Tribunal Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia

Page 17675

1 Tuesday, 17 June 2003

2 [Closed session]

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11 [Open session]

12 JUDGE AGIUS: Yes, we are in open session. Ms. Sutherland, you

13 filed -- or you gave us this morning confidential Prosecution's reasons

14 for requesting Rule 65 ter conference. First of all, I am lifting

15 immediately the confidentiality because I see no reason why this should be

16 treated confidential. It regards the management of the case and there

17 should be nothing confidential about that. There should be absolute

18 transparency.

19 MS. SUTHERLAND: Your Honour, I'm sorry. There is, in paragraph

20 10, if we could file a redacted version. It names the name of a witness

21 who will be testifying in closed session.

22 JUDGE AGIUS: Yes. That will be -- you will indicate that to the

23 registrar. It will be redacted. But otherwise, the document itself will

24 not be confidential. That's number one.

25 Number two, I find objection to what you state in para 2, namely

Page 17707

1 that on Monday, 10th June, 2003 a Rule 65 ter conference was held in

2 chambers. You may think it was a Rule 65 ter conference. I think you

3 ought to know that I invited, and together with the other two Judges, we

4 invited you to a discussion in my chambers, never hinting at any given

5 moment that this was going to be a formal 65 ter conference. So that is

6 being corrected by the Chamber for the record.

7 MS. SUTHERLAND: Your Honour, I apologise for that.

8 JUDGE AGIUS: It's okay. It's just a misunderstanding.

9 MS. SUTHERLAND: I assumed that the meeting was pursuant to Rule

10 65 ter M, which says that the Trial Chamber can hold meetings in mutatis

11 mutandis as they do pre-trial.

12 JUDGE AGIUS: No, no, no, no. It was not a 65 ter. It was -- was

13 supposed to be a frank meeting between us.

14 Mr. Cunningham --

15 MS. SUTHERLAND: Your Honour, if I may, there's just one other

16 paragraph I would like to correct, in paragraph 19. The word "not" was

17 inadvertently missed out of the second sentence. It should read: "The

18 brief was not an adequate response."

19 JUDGE AGIUS: Okay. Thank you.

20 Now, Mr. Cunningham, I suppose -- I don't know whether this has

21 already been notified to Mr. Ackerman.

22 MR. CUNNINGHAM: I don't know, Your Honour. I got my copy this

23 morning.

24 JUDGE AGIUS: Yes. But I suggest to you that you let Mr. Ackerman

25 know about it, and we would like some kind of early response, because this

Page 17708

1 is a matter that cannot be obviously left indefinitely to be discussed

2 when he comes again, when he shows up again. So I would suggest to you to

3 communicate this to him, and in particular, we would like -- first of all,

4 we would like a response in general.

5 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Very well.

6 JUDGE AGIUS: Secondly, in particular, he is asked to indicate

7 whether he agrees with what is being described as being his position in

8 paras -- or the Defence position in paras 28 and 29. And his comments or

9 suggestions as regards what is stated or is being suggested by the

10 Prosecution in para 30 of the document.

11 If you can come back at the end of the break, or later on today,

12 with some kind of response, that would be extremely helpful.

13 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Your Honours, I will try to have that by the end

14 of this break.

15 JUDGE AGIUS: All right. Thank you. Yes, Ms. Sutherland.

16 MS. SUTHERLAND: Your Honour, I'm sorry. Also paragraph 11 needs

17 to be redacted. That's -- a motion will be filed shortly for that

18 evidence to be held in closed session.

19 JUDGE AGIUS: Yes, but that --

20 MS. SUTHERLAND: And reference to it in paragraph 8.

21 JUDGE AGIUS: See with the -- indicate to the registrar which

22 parts of this document you need -- or you require to be redacted and there

23 will be no -- absolutely no problem.

24 MS. SUTHERLAND: And there may be something in paragraph 12 that

25 needs to be redacted.

Page 17709

1 JUDGE AGIUS: -- no problem with us.

2 MS. SUTHERLAND: Thank you, Your Honour.

3 JUDGE AGIUS: Okay. No problems there. Yes. We'll reconvene at

4 11.00. Thank you.

5 --- Recess taken at 10.35 a.m.

6 --- On resuming at 11.04 a.m.

7 [Closed session]

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9 [Open session]

10 JUDGE AGIUS: We are in open session.

11 Yes, Mr. Cunningham.

12 MR. CUNNINGHAM: [Microphone not activated] Before our last

13 break --

14 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone, Mr. Cunningham.

15 JUDGE AGIUS: Microphone.

16 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Before the last break, the court asked me to

17 contact Mr. Ackerman to discover -- to relay to the Court the Defence's

18 response to the motion filed today by the OTP, specifically, paragraphs

19 28, 29, and 30. I've talked to Mr. Ackerman, and first of all we will

20 have a written response to the Court tomorrow, but I can give the Court an

21 idea of our position.

22 Paragraph 28 deals with the time allocated for summation and

23 closing arguments and the Prosecutor's request that it be reduced. With

24 respect to paragraph 28 as per Mr. Ackerman, we have no objection to that.

25 JUDGE AGIUS: So I take it that the Defence agrees that it will

Page 17756

1 only require two days for its closing arguments.

2 MR. CUNNINGHAM: That's fair, Your Honour.

3 JUDGE AGIUS: Okay.

4 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Paragraph 29, Mr. Ackerman will let you know

5 tomorrow, and I don't say that out of disrespect, that something --

6 JUDGE AGIUS: I don't expect something like this to be confirmed

7 on two feet, without any prior notice.

8 MR. CUNNINGHAM: And with respect to paragraph 30, the Prosecution

9 clearly states that they're not aware of our view. I'll tell the Court

10 and them, at this point we are not willing to reduce the time for filing

11 our final briefs from four weeks to three weeks. We would like to keep it

12 at four weeks.

13 JUDGE AGIUS: Thank you. So we'll hear from you later on. And

14 may I also ask you to confer with Mr. Ackerman, come back to us when you

15 are in a position to do so. Last week, before Mr. Ackerman withdrew, or

16 retired, he said that he was -- he would be thinking about the possibility

17 of filing a motion asking for a longer period for more time to present --

18 to file the Rule 98 bis motion. Do you know anything with regard to that

19 motion? We haven't received any motion it that effect, in any case,

20 but ...

21 MR. CUNNINGHAM: And I don't have anything to report to the Court

22 on that, but I will guarantee the Court I'll have a report for you in the

23 morning.

24 JUDGE AGIUS: All right. Thank you. I appreciate that.

25 MR. CUNNINGHAM: Thank you, Your Honour.

Page 17757

1 JUDGE AGIUS: So we'll have a break. We'll resume in 25 minutes

2 from now. Thank you.

3 --- Recess taken at 12.29 p.m.

4 --- On resuming at 1.01 p.m.

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19 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 1.59 p.m.,

20 to be reconvened on Wednesday, the 18th day of

21 June 2003, at 9.00 a.m.

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