1 Monday, 27th September, 1999
2 [Status Conference]
3 [Open session]
4 --- Upon commencing at 4.03 p.m.
5 JUDGE MAY: Thank you.
6 Now, are there any other matters before we
7 turn to the Status Conference or, indeed, any matters
8 for the Status Conference? Mr. Fila, yes.
9 MR. FILA: [Interpretation] I apologise, but
10 there is a problem that we need to address.
11 According to the Rules, it is very important
12 whether the accused are cooperative, whether they
13 assist the Court and so on. The accused Radic has
14 spoken to Mr. Keegan and the police. I signed that
15 tape as confidential. I was given one, the
16 Prosecution, and a third for the Court.
17 Without my knowledge and approval, those same
18 tapes are in the possession of Mr. Krstan Simic.
19 Personally, I don't mind, because I would have given
20 them to him if he asked for them. But the question is,
21 that I should like this Trial Chamber to address, if
22 these tapes are given to anyone without the approval of
23 Defence counsel, how sure can we be that people will be
24 ready to cooperate, risking that what they are saying
25 may be made public?
1 Mr. Krstan Simic is a member of parliament of
2 the Republika Srpska. He could have broadcast that at
3 a parliamentary meeting. As we tend, in Serbia, to
4 accuse each other of being traitors, that's the kind of
5 people we are. This could happen too: Someone could
6 say, "This one was a traitor." So I think a decision
7 by the Trial Chamber would be desirable, a decision
8 that would limit access to such material.
9 In a way, we know that judgements are public
10 and so on, but when something is of this nature, I fear
11 that by such a ready access to such materials, the idea
12 of cooperation with the Prosecution may be
14 I apologise for raising this matter, but I
15 feel that a ruling needs to be made. If you were to
16 see that tape, you would see that it was stated there
17 that without his approval, the tape would not be used,
18 except for in the internal needs of the Prosecution,
19 until it is tendered into evidence.
20 It is a highly-delicate issue, and I would
21 appeal to the Trial Chamber to make a ruling about it.
22 Thank you.
23 JUDGE MAY: Mr. Niemann, yes.
24 MR. NIEMANN: Your Honours, in relation to
25 that matter, firstly let me say that I am very
1 concerned about anything that would interfere with
2 potential cooperation between an accused person and the
3 Prosecution, and I would like to assure counsel, all
4 counsel for the Defence, that we are very sensitive to
5 this. If we have created any concern by disclosing
6 this material, then that's a matter that is of concern
7 to us.
8 The situation is, Your Honours, that counsel
9 for other accused persons in this trial asked for the
10 records of interview that have been conducted between
11 other accused. In this case, we have one particular
12 record, or I think there is more than one. There was a
13 number of records of interview which we disclosed. We
14 believed it was our obligation to disclose it under
15 Rule 66, if the record of the interview was to be
16 regarded as evidence against other accused persons. If
17 it wasn't, if it was only to be evidence in relation to
18 the accused who participated in the record of
19 interview, then we wouldn't have believed that we had
20 an obligation. So when we disclosed the document, we
21 wrote a letter and said, "It is disclosed on the basis
22 that the Prosecution will maintain that the evidence of
23 that person is evidence against your client."
24 Now, if there are any concerns about these
25 records of interview being made prematurely public,
1 because ultimately it's our intention to tender them in
2 the course of the proceedings anyway as a public
3 exhibit, but if there is concerns that they may be
4 prematurely disclosed, we would remind Your Honours
5 that the general order of non-disclosure should apply
6 to Mr. Simic as well as anybody else. But if there is
7 any concern about that, we join with and support the
8 Defence in an order -- in seeking from Your Honours an
9 order that if the Prosecution -- that in respect of any
10 records of interview disclosed to other parties by the
11 Prosecution pursuant to its obligation, that those
12 records of interview not be made public.
13 JUDGE MAY: Mr. Niemann, just to assist, the
14 tapes that we're talking about are interviews in
15 relation to these events?
16 MR. NIEMANN: Yes, Your Honour.
17 JUDGE MAY: Like a police interview.
18 MR. NIEMANN: Yes, Your Honour.
19 JUDGE MAY: So it normally would be
20 discloseable, wouldn't it?
21 MR. NIEMANN: There's an argument, Your
22 Honour, that if it's not to be used as evidence against
23 the other accused, then our obligations under Rule 66,
24 it's arguable we don't have an obligation to disclose
1 The approach that I would like to take
2 ordinarily is that they should be disclosed anyway
3 because they are a matter that is going to arise during
4 the trial. But I did take the precaution of having a
5 letter accompany it, saying it was disclosed on that
7 JUDGE MAY: Without prejudice, as it were,
8 without finding what's happened in this particular case
9 or, indeed, if anything has happened, would it be
10 sensible then to make an order restricting the
11 disclosure of the records of interview, as you
13 MR. NIEMANN: Yes, Your Honour, it would be
14 sensible, because I am concerned about any issue that
15 the Defence may raise which may interfere or hinder
16 persistence with the Prosecution, so we would certainly
17 ask Your Honours to do that. We can put it in a formal
18 application, if Your Honours would prefer that.
19 [Trial Chamber confers]
20 JUDGE MAY: Yes, we'll make the order. I
21 think the legal officer will have sufficient for us to
22 draw up an order.
23 Yes. Are there any other matters, please?
24 [Trial Chamber confers]
25 JUDGE MAY: We'll go into private session now
1 for the final matters.
2 THE REGISTRAR: We are now in private
4 [Private session]
13 pages 219-222 redacted – private session
23 --- Whereupon the Status Conference
24 adjourned at 4.10 p.m. sine die