090318ED

Page 4462

1 Good afternoon, Mr. Randall.

2 THE WITNESS: Good afternoon, Your Honour.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: I do know you know this. But I just wanted to

4 remind you once again to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing

5 else but the truth as you undertook at the beginning of your testimony.

6 THE WITNESS: I understand that.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

8 Mr. Harmon.

9 WITNESS: BRETTON RANDALL [Resumed]

10 Examination by Mr. Harmon: [Continued]

11 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I have reorganised the presentation

12 that I had intended to present today. I had organised various schedules

13 in various thematic binders. In order to be more efficient, I propose

14 that we proceed in the way we proceeded at the beginning of yesterday's

15 sessions. There are a series of schedules and that I will identify the

16 schedules which I have asked to be distributed to Your Honours and to

17 counsel and to the witness. There are nine schedules that relate to

18 personnel files, and then there are other schedules on different topics.

19 But if we could proceed in that manner first, and then I will proceed,

20 follow that up by showing exemplars of various types of documents.

21 JUDGE MOLOTO: You may proceed, Mr. Harmon.

22 MR. HARMON: Yes.

23 Q. Mr. Randall, in front you there is a series of schedules. The

24 first is Beara personnel file. Could you examine that, please, and

25 inform us whether the provenance of each of those documents listed there

Page 4463

1 is accurate.

2 A. That is accurate.

3 MR. HARMON: I would ask that each of the items on the schedule

4 then be given an exhibit number, Your Honour.

5 MR. LUKIC: For all personnel files given to us, including the

6 last one which is Pandurevic, generally we have no objection.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: Including Pandurevic.

8 Mr. Harmon, wouldn't you then, on those personnel files proceed

9 the way we did yesterday with the whole lot of them? And we get --

10 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I'm happy to do. Let me just identify

11 them.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okey-doke.

13 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, then the items that are in the

14 personnel files, they are the Celeketic personnel file, the Gvero

15 personnel file, the Krstic personnel file, the Mladic personnel file, the

16 Mrksic personnel file, Obrenovic personnel file, and the Popovic

17 personnel file, and the Sladojevic personnel file.

18 Those are the personnel files. And I would ask that each of the

19 items in there be given an exhibit number and the shaded items be

20 admitted under seal.

21 JUDGE MOLOTO: And am I to understand, Mr. Harmon, that there are

22 two Mrksic personnel files? There's one before Mladic and another after.

23 MR. HARMON: That should not be the case, Your Honour. There

24 should be one. It should go in order of Celeketic, Gvero, Krstic,

25 Mladic, Mrksic, Obrenovic. So there should be one Mrksic personnel file.

Page 4464

1 I'm not sure why Your Honour received two. It is obviously an error.

2 The Mrksic personnel file starts with 05016 at the upper

3 left-hand corner. It's one page; it ends with a protected document at

4 the bottom.

5 JUDGE MOLOTO: Well, -- sorry. I beg your pardon. It's -- yeah,

6 no, no, sorry. My mistake.

7 Madam Registrar, all those documents listed in all those

8 schedules are admitted, on condition that the shaded parts are admitted

9 under seal. May it please be given an exhibit number, at your

10 convenience.

11 You may proceed, Mr. Harmon.

12 MR. HARMON: Thank you, Your Honour.

13 Q. Mr. Randall, the next schedule that is in front of you is

14 entitled Pandurevic Prosecution file. Could you examine that and tell us

15 if the provenance identified in each of those items is accurate.

16 A. That is accurate.

17 MR. HARMON: I would ask that each of those items be given an

18 exhibit number and the two shaded items in the schedule be placed under

19 seal.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: Let's just give your learned colleague an

21 opportunity. It looks like he is talking to those instructing him.

22 MR. LUKIC: No objection, Your Honour.

23 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much, Mr. Lukic.

24 Madam Registrar, those are all admitted in the Pandurevic

25 Prosecution file; the shaded ones under seal.

Page 4465

1 Yes.

2 MR. HARMON:

3 Q. Mr. Randall, then, if we could turn to the next schedule,

4 entitled appointments and transfers. Can you examine that, please.

5 A. That is accurate.

6 MR. HARMON: I would request that each of these items receive an

7 exhibit number, Your Honour.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Lukic.

9 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] In relation to this group of

10 documents, the group challenges the authenticity and suggests that the

11 following documents be just marked for identification: 05515, 05538,

12 05568, 05573, 05583, 07962, and 08889.

13 As for the remaining tendered documents, we have no objections

14 for them being accepted.

15 MR. HARMON: I have no objection to that, Your Honour.

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

17 Madam Registrar, if you could admit all those documents and mark

18 for identification those mentioned by Mr. Lukic.

19 MR. HARMON:

20 Q. Mr. Randall, could you look at the next schedule entitled

21 "Promotions."

22 A. That is accurate.

23 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I would ask that each of these items

24 receive an exhibit number.

25 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] In relation to this group of

Page 4466

1 documents, the Defence proposes that the following documents be marked

2 for identification. Those are 5502, 5503, 5584, and 5504.

3 As for the remaining documents, we have no objections to them

4 being admitted, with a proviso that in our view, in our understanding,

5 the description of the documents that we can see in the tables does not

6 correspond to the actual contents of these documents. We just wanted you

7 to be aware of this, but that doesn't mean that we are challenging these

8 documents.

9 MR. HARMON: No objection to that, Your Honour.

10 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

11 Madam Registrar, can you admit all documents and mark for

12 identification those mentioned.

13 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

14 MR. HARMON:

15 Q. Mr. Randall, could you turn to the table, "Croatian intelligence

16 reports."

17 A. That is accurate.

18 MR. HARMON: I would ask that each of those items receive an

19 exhibit number, Your Honour.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: Mr. Lukic.

21 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] The Defence proposes that the entire

22 group of these documents be marked for identification for the time being.

23 We challenge the authenticity of these documents, given their form and

24 given the provenance.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: [Microphone not activated].

Page 4467

1 MR. HARMON: I have no objection, Your Honour.

2 JUDGE MOLOTO: Will you please admit the entire documents and

3 mark them all for identification.

4 MR. HARMON:

5 Q. Mr. Randall, the next schedule is entitled "Coordination."

6 A. That is accurate.

7 MR. HARMON: Could each of these items, Your Honour, receive an

8 exhibit number.

9 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] In relation to two documents from

10 this list, we suggest that they just be marked for identification. Those

11 are documents 8778 and 5483.

12 In negotiations with Mr. Harmon, we objected to the title of

13 these documents. We suggested that they be titled "information," and I

14 think that Mr. Harmon did concede that they would look into giving a more

15 appropriate title to these documents.

16 MR. HARMON: Well, I certainly apologise if that's the case. I'm

17 happy to call them "information," Your Honour.

18 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much. For the time being they are

19 called "coordination." You can rest assured, Mr. Lukic, the Trial

20 Chamber is not going to check whether the documents are coordinated. We

21 are just going to look at the documents themselves and not the list --

22 and they will be called "information" as and when the labelling has been

23 changed. Thank you so much.

24 Madam Registrar, will you admit the entire documents and mark for

25 identification the two that are mentioned.

Page 4468

1 MR. HARMON:

2 Q. Mr. Randall, the next schedule is one deferred from yesterday.

3 It is entitled "VRS Main Staff intelligence report/information to VJ

4 General Staff intelligence administration."

5 A. That's accurate.

6 MR. HARMON: I would ask that each of the items be given an

7 exhibit number and that the one shaded item be placed under seal.

8 MR. GUY-SMITH: With regard to 01154, 05554, and 05555, we would

9 ask they be marked for identification. The balance we have no objection

10 to.

11 MR. HARMON: No objection, Your Honour.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Registrar, can you admit all those, mark the

13 shaded one -- mark it under -- admit it under seal, rather, and those are

14 the ones that are mentioned by Mr. Guy-Smith, marked for identification.

15 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

16 MR. HARMON:

17 Q. The final list, Mr. Randall, is entitled "VJ collegium minutes."

18 Could you examine that, please.

19 A. That is accurate.

20 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, you'll notice on this page, starting at

21 page 3, there some of these VJ collegium minutes that were not on

22 Mr. Randall's master list, but in discussions with the Defence they have

23 no objection to these being added to the schedule. We would ask that

24 each of these items be given an exhibit number.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: We are having no reaction?

Page 4469

1 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Yes. We did not object to have them

2 put on the list of the tendered document. However, the Defence suggest

3 that all of these documents be marked for identification because we

4 challenge their authenticity.

5 MR. HARMON: We have no objection to that, Your Honour.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

7 Madam Registrar, will you admit all those documents and mark them

8 all for identification.

9 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

10 MR. HARMON: That concludes the schedules, Your Honour. And now

11 I would like to proceed with some exemplars. If I could have 65 ter

12 1084 --

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: Your colleague is on his feet. [Microphone not

14 activated]

15 MR. HARMON: Oh, I'm sorry.

16 MR. GUY-SMITH: There was one other schedule from yesterday which

17 had been identified as miscellaneous which we promised we would revert to

18 you today about.

19 MR. HARMON: That's fine. I was under the assumption that it had

20 been admitted yesterday. But let me check. And I will go through these

21 exemplars, and I will quickly check on the status of that schedule.

22 Thank you.

23 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Harmon.

24 MR. HARMON: And if could I have 65 ter 1804. And I'm interested

25 in putting on the screen, ET 04228341. I'm interested in page 2 of the

Page 4470

1 English, and I believe that is page 10 of the B/C/S.

2 JUDGE MOLOTO: I'm slightly lost, Mr. Harmon. You're using a

3 method we haven't used so far. What do we write? Do we write 1804, or

4 do we write ET 04228341?

5 MR. HARMON: I'm sorry. I have even called out the wrong number.

6 On the screen it says 1804. I intended to put up 1084.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: I have 1084 on my notepad, yes.

8 MR. HARMON: Yes. Alright.

9 And then I would ask the Registrar to turn to a particular page

10 in that exhibit, which is -- I can identify by the translation number in

11 the upper right-hand corner, which is 0 -- is page 2 of the English is

12 what I'm looking for.

13 And this is found at page 51 of the master list.

14 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document?

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: Just before Mr. Randall does that, I don't see a

16 correction of this 65 ter number on the screen. I would like to like see

17 the stenographer typing 1084 instead of 1804, because there is no way of

18 correcting this once we have gone.

19 You may proceed.

20 MR. HARMON:

21 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify document that is before you?

22 A. Yes, this is a page from a the Yugoslav army personnel file

23 related to Radislav Krstic. And it was received from the government of

24 Serbia and Montenegro in response to Request for Assistance 830.

25 MR. HARMON: And if this -- Your Honour, I'd ask that the whole

Page 4471

1 document -- I tender the whole file of 1084, even though have I only

2 shown one page of that document, I would ask that the whole document be

3 admitted into evidence.

4 MR. LUKIC: No objection, Your Honour.

5 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much. The whole document may be

6 admitted and be given an exhibit number.

7 THE REGISTRAR: Your Honours, that will be Exhibit P1893.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

9 MR. HARMON: Then the next document, Your Honours,

10 Madam Registrar, is 65 ter 7959, please. That's found at page 157 of the

11 master list.

12 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify document 7959, please.

13 A. This is order number 5-335 of the chief of the personnel

14 administration of the General Staff of the Yugoslav army dated

15 26 September 1994, related to Radislav Krstic, bearing the signatory

16 chief Major-General Dusan Zoric, and that was received from the

17 government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

18 Assistance 1593.

19 MR. HARMON: I would ask, Your Honour, this receive an exhibit

20 number.

21 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] We have no objections, Your Honour.

22 I'm just worried that we might encounter a problem. Previously the

23 entire dossier of Mr. Krstic was admitted in the previous exhibit, and I

24 think that this is also part of that file, of Mr. Krstic, and now I'm

25 worried that we are duplicating the documents. I don't know whether we

Page 4472

1 could just give one exhibit number to the entire file. Other than that,

2 I have no objections.

3 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I believe this is a separate document.

4 This is a document that is -- while it identifies General Krstic and

5 while reference is made in the previous exhibit to this particular order

6 number, this document 7959 is a document that identifies the transfer --

7 93 officers who is were transferred and appointed to the 30th Personnel

8 Centre.

9 So this is a separate document with people other than

10 General Krstic on it. And I don't believe this whole document is found

11 in General Krstic's personnel file.

12 So we're asking for a separate number on this document.

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: You don't believe or you --

14 MR. HARMON: I don't believe, Your Honour -- [Overlapping

15 speakers] ...

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: -- or you're concern?

17 MR. HARMON: Well, I'm not certain. But I -- quite -- quite

18 confident that in General Krstic's personnel file, there is not going to

19 be the appointment and transfer orders for 93 other officers.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okay. If, indeed, it is a duplicate, it may be

21 just that one duplicate. We'll admitted that and give it an exhibit

22 number, Madam Registrar, please.

23 THE REGISTRAR: That will Exhibit P1894, Your Honour.

24 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you. That's the whole document,

25 Madam Registrar.

Page 4484

1 MR. HARMON: The next item is 65 ter 7839, and I'm interested in

2 06115577 of the English being displayed. That's found at page 133 of the

3 master list.

4 Could I have the English 06115577, please. Thank you.

5 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document, please, and its

6 source.

7 A. This is a Yugoslav army General Staff sector for recruitment

8 mobilisation and system issues, personnel administration, dated

9 23 January 1996. It's a decision concerning Bogdan Subotic,

10 Major-General, provided by government of Republic of Serbia in response

11 Request for Assistance 1560.

12 MR. HARMON: I would request that the whole file be given an

13 exhibit number, Your Honour.

14 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: The whole file is admitted. May it please be

16 given an exhibit number.

17 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1907, Your Honours.

18 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

19 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

20 MR. HARMON: The next exhibit is 65 ter 8387, please. It's found

21 at page 189 of the master list.

22 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document and its source.

23 A. This is a decree of the President of the Federal Republic of

24 Yugoslavia, dated 22 December 1994, related to Major-General

25 Milan Celeketic, bearing the name President Zoran Lilic, provided by the

Page 4485

1 government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

2 Assistance 1560.

3 MR. HARMON: I would ask that this receive an exhibit number,

4 Your Honour.

5 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: May that please be given an exhibit number.

7 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1908, Your Honours.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

9 MR. HARMON: Could I have 65 ter 8388 on the screen. And that is

10 at page 189 of the master list.

11 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document, please, and its

12 source.

13 A. This is a decision issued by the Yugoslav army military post

14 number 1790, dated 30 December 1994, concerning Major-General

15 Milan Celeketic, bearing the name chief Major-General Dusan Zoric,

16 provided by the government of the Republic of Serbia in response to

17 Request for Assistance 1560.

18 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

19 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

21 number, madam Registrar.

22 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1909, Your Honours.

23 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

24 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

25 MR. HARMON: Can I have 65 ter 8393 on the monitor, and that's

Page 4486

1 found at page 190 of the master list.

2 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document and its source,

3 please.

4 A. This is titled an Official Note of the interview with the Chief

5 of the General Staff of the Yugoslav army conducted with Major-General

6 Milan Celeketic bearing the name Colonel General Momcilo Perisic received

7 from the government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

8 Assistance 1560.

9 MR. HARMON: I would as that this document receive an exhibit

10 number, please.

11 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

13 number, Madam Registrar.

14 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1910, Your Honours.

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

16 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

17 MR. HARMON: The next exhibit is 7857, and it is found at page

18 137 of the master list, and I am interested in the page 06117965 being

19 displayed.

20 THE WITNESS: Sorry, what page on the master list?

21 MR. HARMON: It should be 137. 7857 is the 65 ter number.

22 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document, please, and its

23 source.

24 A. This is a request for payment of special compensation for unused

25 annual leave from Milan Celeketic to military post 1790, Belgrade.

Page 4487

1 Provided by the government of the Republic of Serbia in response to

2 Request for Assistance 1560.

3 MR. HARMON: I would ask, Your Honour, that the whole file be

4 admitted, given an exhibit number.

5 JUDGE MOLOTO: It is admitted --

6 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Just a minute, Your Honour.

7 [Defence counsel confer]

8 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] We have just one general objection,

9 Your Honour, that this pertains to the matters which are outside of the

10 temporal scope of the indictment and also to the period between 1993 and

11 1995, which is something that was decided after the time-period covered

12 by the indictment.

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: That objection that is covered by a previous

14 ruling. I admit.

15 Give an exhibit number, the entire document.

16 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1911, Your Honours.

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

18 MR. HARMON: And, Your Honour I was interested in having the

19 whole file admitted, not just the single document.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: I did say entire document, didn't I?

21 MR. HARMON: Okay, I -- since ...

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okay. If I didn't say so, I now say so.

23 MR. HARMON: Thank you, Your Honour.

24 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

25 MR. HARMON: Could I then have 8532 on the screen, and that is

Page 4488

1 found at page 194 of the master list.

2 JUDGE MOLOTO: 85 ...

3 MR. HARMON: 32. Found at page 194 of the master list.

4 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document and its source,

5 please.

6 A. This is a copy of a decree of the President of the Federal

7 Republic of Yugoslavia, dated 22 December 1994, concerning

8 Lieutenant-General Milan Novakovic in the name of President Zoran Lilic,

9 provided by the government of the Republic of Serbia in response to

10 Request for Assistance 1560.

11 MR. HARMON: I request an exhibit number, Your Honour, for this

12 item.

13 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: The document is admitted into evidence. May it

15 please be given an exhibit number for the entire document.

16 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1912, Your Honours.

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

18 MR. HARMON: Could I have 8533 on the monitor, please, found at

19 195 of the master list.

20 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this particular document and its

21 source.

22 A. This is a Yugoslav army military post number 1790, Belgrade,

23 decision, related to Lieutenant-General Mile Novakovic bearing the name

24 chief Major-General Zoric, provided by the government of the Republic of

25 Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1560.

Page 4489

1 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

2 JUDGE MOLOTO: The document is admitted.

3 May it please be given an exhibit number.

4 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1913, Your Honours.

5 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

6 MR. HARMON: The next item is 8534, found at 195 of the master

7 list.

8 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document and its source.

9 A. Statement in the name of Lieutenant-General Mile Novakovic,

10 military post 9000 Knin, dated 16 September 1995, bearing the name

11 Lieutenant-General Mile Novakovic, provided by the government of the

12 Republic of Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1560.

13 MR. HARMON: I would request that this receive an exhibit number,

14 Your Honour.

15 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted.

17 May it please be given an exhibit number.

18 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1914, Your Honours.

19 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

20 MR. HARMON: Could I have 7867 on the monitor. That's found at

21 page 139 of the master list. What I want to do is display a number of

22 pages out of this particular exhibit number. So if we could start with

23 06119285, if we could display that page, firstly, on the list -- on the

24 monitor.

25 Q. Mr. Randall, since these all bear the same exhibit number, I'm

Page 4490

1 going to ask you the source at the end. But can you, first of all,

2 identify the document -- well, we don't have the -- we don't have the

3 B/C/S version yet on the monitor. I'm sorry.

4 A. In English I can identify the decree issued presidential decree

5 of the President of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia, dated

6 22 December 1994, related to Mirko Bjelanovic. That was provided by the

7 government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

8 Assistance 1560.

9 MR. HARMON: Could I have the page 9286 of that same exhibit on

10 the monitor, please.

11 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document.

12 A. Can you make it a little bit -- yeah, thank you.

13 It's a decision of the military post 1790, Belgrade, dated

14 30 December 1994, related to Mirko Bjelanovic, bearing the name chief

15 Major-General Dusan Zoric, again, provided in response to Request for

16 Assistance 1560 by the government of the Republic of Serbia.

17 MR. HARMON: And finally if we could go to 06119263 of this same

18 exhibit, and I'm interested in page 3 of the English.

19 Could I have -- yes, that's the document in English. Could I

20 have the same document in B/C/S.

21 Q. Can you identify this particular document, Mr. Randall?

22 A. This is a statement bearing the name Major-General

23 Mirko Bjelanovic, dated 7 October 1995. He agrees to put him at the

24 disposal of the commander of the army of the Republika Srpska. That was

25 received also in response to Request for Assistance 1560 provided by the

Page 4491

1 government of the Republic of Serbia.

2 MR. HARMON: And could 7867, the whole file be given an exhibit

3 number, Your Honour.

4 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

5 JUDGE MOLOTO: The whole file is admitted into evidence.

6 May it please be given an exhibit number.

7 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1915, Your Honours.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

9 MR. HARMON: Could I have 65 ter 493 on the monitor, please,

10 found at page 27 of the master list. And I would like to display two

11 pages of this, 04222982.

12 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document, please, and its

13 source.

14 A. This is a decree of the President of the Federal Republic of

15 Yugoslavia, dated 22 December 1994, related to termination of

16 professional military service of Mile Mrksic, bearing the name President

17 Zoran Lilic, provided by the government of the Serbia and Montenegro in

18 response Request for Assistance 590.

19 MR. HARMON: If we could look at one more page in this document.

20 It is 04222981.

21 Q. Again, Mr. Randall, can you identify the document.

22 A. This is a decision of the Yugoslav army military post number 1790

23 Belgrade, related to Colonel General Mile Mrksic, bearing the name chief

24 Major-General Dusan Zoric. That was also provided by the government of

25 Serbia and Montenegro in response to Request for Assistance 590.

Page 4492

1 MR. HARMON: And, Your Honour, I would ask that this -- this

2 whole file be given an exhibit number and admitted.

3 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Once again, I think that the entire

4 personnel file of Mr. Mrksic has already been admitted. If it is not a

5 duplication, we have no objection.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okay. The entire file is admitted. May it please

7 be given an exhibit number.

8 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1916, Your Honours.

9 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

10 MR. HARMON: And could I finally in this series of documents, and

11 we'll end with more document. It is 05018, which is found at page 70 of

12 the master list.

13 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document, please, and its

14 source.

15 A. It is a statement accepting termination of professional military

16 service, dated 7 October 1995 in the name Colonel General Mile Mrksic,

17 provided by the government of Serbia and Montenegro in response to

18 Request for Assistance 590.

19 MR. HARMON: Could this be given an exhibit number, Your Honour.

20 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

21 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

22 number.

23 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1917, Your Honours.

24 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

25 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, this would be a convenient time to

Page 4493

1 break.

2 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

3 We'll take a break and come back at 4.00.

4 Court adjourned.

5 --- Recess taken at 3.31 p.m.

6 --- On resuming at 4.00 p.m.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Harmon.

8 MR. HARMON: If I could have 65 ter 8397 on the monitor. That's

9 found at page 190 of the master list.

10 Q. Mr. Randall, can you examine the document and identify it and

11 also identities provenance, please.

12 A. It's a request for the payment of unpaid salaries, bearing the

13 name Milan Celeketic, dated 24 May 2003 to the military post 1790,

14 Belgrade. That was issued -- provided by the government of the Republic

15 of Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1560.

16 MR. HARMON: Could that receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

17 MR. LUKIC: No objection.

18 JUDGE MOLOTO: It is admitted.

19 May it please be given an exhibit number.

20 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1918, Your Honours.

21 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

22 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

23 MR. HARMON: Could I have 65 ter 5638 on the monitor. And that

24 is found at page 103 of the master list.

25 Can you scroll up on the English, please. Yes, thank you.

Page 4494

1 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document and its source.

2 A. This is a decision, dated 11 October 2000, related to the

3 entitlement of Colonel General Ratko Mladic to receive salaries and

4 special compensation. That was issued in the name chief Colonel

5 Milan Biga, provided by the government of Serbia and Montenegro in

6 response to Request for Assistance 1127-B.

7 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

8 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] The general objection that we raised

9 so far, namely, that you said -- you ruled that this document is not

10 relevant because it pertains to the period after the one covered by the

11 indictment.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Is that what I ruled?

13 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Correct.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: And would it be coming back if it was already

15 ruled inadmissible?

16 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No, no. Perhaps we misunderstood

17 each other. This is a general objection, that you overruled. And our

18 socks that this document is outside of the temporal scope of the

19 indictment.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you, Mr. Lukic. I was just responding to

21 what I read on the screen.

22 Okay. It's admitted.

23 May it please be given an exhibit number, please.

24 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1919, Your Honours.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

Page 4495

1 MR. HARMON: Could I have 1235 on the monitor. It is found at

2 page 58 of the master list. And the page I would like displayed is

3 0603-0673.

4 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document and its source,

5 please.

6 A. This is a decision -- I can't -- I can't state what the military

7 post is. It's dated 2 September 2000. Related to Ljubisa Beara, serving

8 at the military post 3001, regarding the recognition of the right to

9 salary and other payments, bearing the name chief Colonel Milan Biga.

10 And that was provided by the government of the Republic of Serbia in

11 response to Request for Assistance 947.

12 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, we would ask that the whole file be

13 given an exhibit number.

14 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] In relation to this document, we have

15 the same general objection we raised in relation to the previous

16 document, and we have no objection to the admittance of the personnel

17 file of Mr. Beara, if this is part of this entire document or perhaps it

18 belongs to some other document. We don't know.

19 MR. HARMON: This is part of the whole file, Your Honour.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

21 May I suggest, Mr. Lukic, in the interests of expediency and

22 expeditiousness that, we did talk of a global objection and a global

23 overruling, unless there is something else to add, let's not stand up,

24 Okay? That would be recognised.

25 It is admitted. May it please be given an exhibit number, the

Page 4496

1 entire file.

2 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1920, Your Honours.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

4 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

5 MR. HARMON: The next exemplar is 65 ter 8552, found at page 196

6 of the master list.

7 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document and its source,

8 please.

9 A. This is a decision of the military post 4001, Belgrade, dated

10 5 May, 1994, related to Mile Novakovic, Major-General, bearing the name

11 officer in charge Major-General Milan Celeketic, provided by the

12 government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

13 Assistance 1344.

14 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

15 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: The document is admitted. May it please be given

17 an exhibit number.

18 THE REGISTRAR: That will be exhibit --

19 JUDGE MOLOTO: Is it a file or just this page?

20 MR. HARMON: It's a separate exhibit, Your Honour.

21 JUDGE MOLOTO: May it please be given an exhibit number.

22 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1921, Your Honours.

23 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

24 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

25 MR. HARMON: Could I have 5192 on the monitor. It's found at

Page 4497

1 page 75 of the master list.

2 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document and its source,

3 please.

4 A. This is a decision of the military post 3001, Belgrade, dated

5 12 May 1994, concerning Colonel Zdravko Tolimir, related to special

6 conditions and allowances, bearing the name officer in charge Colonel

7 Mico Grubor, provided by government of the Serbia and Montenegro in

8 response to Request for Assistance 548.

9 MR. HARMON: Could this, Your Honour, receive an exhibit number.

10 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

11 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

12 number.

13 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1922, Your Honours.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

15 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

16 MR. HARMON: 65 ter 5641, which is found at page 103 of the

17 master list.

18 Could you scroll up on the English, please. Thank you.

19 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document and its source.

20 A. This is a decision of the military post 3001, Belgrade, dated

21 24 February 2000, concerning Colonel-General Ratko Mladic and his

22 entitlement to receive special compensation, bearing the name chief

23 Colonel Milan Biga, provided by the government of Serbia and Montenegro

24 in response to Request for Assistance 1127-B.

25 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

Page 4500

1 Montenegro in response to Request for Assistance 1127-B.

2 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's is admitted.

4 May it please be given an exhibit number.

5 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1924, Your Honours.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

7 MR. HARMON: I would like to call up 7867. This has previously

8 been, I believe, exhibited.

9 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, it is P1195.

10 MR. HARMON: Could I have P1195 on the monitor. And the page I'm

11 interested in is 06119268, and I'm interested in page 2.

12 Q. Mr. Randall, can you --

13 MR. HARMON: I'm not sure that this is the same -- this doesn't

14 appear be to the same document in B/C/S that it appears in the English.

15 This appears to be same document, Your Honour.

16 Q. So, Mr. Randall, can you identify this document.

17 A. This is a request for a certificate on participation in war,

18 bearing the name retired Major-General Mirko Bjelanovic, dated

19 3 March 1999, Belgrade, to the military post 1790 Belgrade. And that was

20 provided by the government of Republic of Serbia in response to Request

21 for Assistance 1560.

22 MR. HARMON: Could I now move to another page, the page with

23 06119270. It's part of the same 7867.

24 Q. Can you just identify the document, Mr. Randall. We've had the

25 source already.

Page 4501

1 A. It's a statement given by Lieutenant-Colonel Milan Miodrag,

2 concerning Major-General Mirko Bjelanovic and his participation as a

3 professional officer in the Yugoslavia army in armed operations.

4 MR. HARMON: And, finally, in this series could I turn to

5 06119268. It is page 1 of the English.

6 Q. Again, Mr. Randall, can you just identify this document.

7 A. It is a General Staff of the Yugoslav army sector for recruitment

8 mobilisation and system issues, personnel administration, document dated

9 4 March 1999, related to Mirko Bjelanovic concerning -- it was located in

10 a particular area, bearing the name Colonel Milos Pavlovic.

11 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, this already has an exhibit number

12 already, so I --

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: Indeed. I was going ask the question, actually

14 why do we go through these documents if they are already admitted as

15 Exhibit 1915.

16 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I intended to just show some exemplars

17 from the exhibit, and I realized afterwards in my presentation that this

18 had been previously been exhibited, so ...

19 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

20 MR. HARMON: If I could turn to another document, then,

21 Your Honour.

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: You can.

23 MR. HARMON: If I could have 65 ter 8954 on the monitor, and

24 that's found at page 205 of the master list.

25 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this particular document and its

Page 4502

1 source.

2 A. This is a Federal Republic of Yugoslavia cabinet of the Chief of

3 the General Staff of the Yugoslav army, dated 24 March 1995. It's an

4 order on the formation of a coordinating staff for assistance to the 40th

5 Personnel Centre, bearing the name Chief of the General Staff of the

6 Yugoslav army Lieutenant-General Momcilo Perisic. And that was provided

7 by the government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

8 Assistance 1350.

9 MR. HARMON: If we could go to the next page of the B/C/S version

10 and to the bottom showing the signature block, and same in the English

11 version, which would be on page 4.

12 And if this could be given an exhibit number, Your Honour.

13 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: The document is admitted. May it please be given

15 an exhibit number.

16 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1925, Your Honour.

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

18 MR. HARMON: Could I have 539 on the monitor, please. It's

19 page 32 of the master list.

20 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this particular document and its

21 source.

22 A. It is a report of the Serbian army of Krajina Main Staff security

23 department dated 1/7/1994, situation in the autonomous province of

24 western Bosnia. That was provided by the Republic of Croatia in response

25 to Request for Assistance 463.

Page 4503

1 MR. HARMON: I would ask that this receive an exhibit number.

2 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] No objection.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted.

4 May it please be given an exhibit number.

5 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1926, Your Honours.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

7 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

8 MR. HARMON: Could I have 8081 on the monitor, please. Page 174

9 of the master list.

10 Q. Can you identify this document, please, Mr. Randall, and its

11 source.

12 A. It's an authorisation of the General Staff of the army of

13 Republika Srpska, dated 20 July 1998, sent to the General Staff,

14 Yugoslav army, sector for education training scientific research and

15 publishing and to personnel administration concerning Vinko Pandurevic.

16 And that was provided by the government of the Republic of Serbia in

17 response to Request for Assistance 1582.

18 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

19 JUDGE MOLOTO: Does it -- it's is admitted.

20 May it please be given an exhibit number.

21 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1927, Your Honours.

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

23 MR. HARMON: Could I have 8080 on the monitor. This is found at

24 page 174 of the master list.

25 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document.

Page 4504

1 A. This is a decision of the national Defence school administration

2 of the Yugoslav army, dated 21 July 1998, related to disciplinary

3 investigation against Colonel Vinko Pandurevic, bearing the name chief of

4 class naval captain Bosko Antic. And it was provided by the government

5 of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1582.

6 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I would request a number for this item.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

8 number.

9 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1928, Your Honours.

10 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

11 MR. HARMON: Could I have 8079 on the monitor. That's at

12 page 173 in the master list.

13 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document and its source,

14 please.

15 A. This is a Yugoslav army military post number 2102, decision dated

16 7 August 1998, Belgrade, related to disciplinary action instituted

17 against Vinko Pandurevic, Colonel. Bearing the name Major-General

18 Professor Sinisa Borovic, provided by the government of the Republic of

19 Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1582.

20 MR. HARMON: I would request this receive an exhibit number,

21 Your Honour.

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

23 number.

24 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1929, Your Honours.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much.

Page 4505

1 Yes, Mr. Harmon.

2 MR. HARMON: Could I have 8704 on the monitor, and found at

3 page 173 of the master list.

4 Q. Mr. Randall, do you --

5 MR. HARMON: Just wait until it shows up on the monitor.

6 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document and its source.

7 A. This is a motion to indict in the name of the military

8 disciplinary prosecutor at the General Staff of the Yugoslav army first

9 instance military disciplinary Prosecution number 3/99, dated

10 19 March 1999, concerning Vinko Pandurevic in the name military

11 disciplinary prosecutor Major Radovan Lavos, provided by the government

12 of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1582.

13 MR. HARMON: Could this receive an exhibit number, Your Honour.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

15 number.

16 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1930, Your Honours.

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

18 MR. HARMON: Could I have 8075 on the monitor, please, found at

19 page 173 of the master list.

20 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document again and its source.

21 A. This is a military disciplinary court at the General Staff of the

22 army of Yugoslavia number 3/99 record of the trial, concerning the

23 disciplinary case against the accused, Lieutenant-Colonel Vinko

24 Pandurevic, and that was provided by the government of the Republic of

25 Serbia in response to Request for Assistance 1582.

Page 4506

1 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I'd as that this be given an exhibit

2 number.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Lukic.

4 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] I know that the [indiscernible]

5 schedule of the Vinko Pandurevic case was admitted. My question is this:

6 Are this document and the previous document parts of that schedule, if

7 they are, then I don't have any special objection.

8 MR. HARMON: These are not part of the previous schedule,

9 Your Honour.

10 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okay. If they're not, then they are admitted.

11 May it please be given an exhibit number.

12 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1931, Your Honours.

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

14 Mr. Harmon.

15 MR. HARMON: The final document in this series is 65 ter 8073

16 which is found at page 172 of the master list.

17 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify the document and its source,

18 please.

19 A. This is a judgement of the military disciplinary court of the

20 General Staff of the Yugoslav army number 3/99, dated 14 October 1999,

21 dismissing charges against Vinko Pandurevic. And that was provided by

22 the government of the Republic of Serbia in response to Request for

23 Assistance 1582.

24 MR. HARMON: I would request that this receive an exhibit number,

25 Your Honour.

Page 4507

1 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted.

2 May it please be given an exhibit number.

3 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1932, Your Honours.

4 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

5 MR. HARMON: Turning to a new type of document.

6 Q. Mr. Randall --

7 MR. HARMON: Madam Registrar, if I could have 1201 on the

8 monitor. That's found at page 55 of the master list.

9 Q. Mr. Randall, can you identify this document, please, and its

10 source.

11 A. It is an intelligence administration report dated 10/7/1995,

12 Zagreb, intelligence information as of July 9th, 1995. Bearing the name

13 chief rear admiral Davor Domazet, provided by the Republic of Croatia in

14 response to Request for Assistance 673.

15 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, could receive an exhibit number.

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Lukic.

17 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] As for the previous document in the

18 group, we would like this document to be marked for identification.

19 MR. HARMON: No objection, Your Honour.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: The document is admitted.

21 May it please be given an exhibit number and be marked for

22 identification.

23 THE REGISTRAR: Your Honour, that will be Exhibit P1933, marked

24 for identification.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

Page 4515

1 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you very much, Mr. Dozo. You may sit down.

2 Yes, Madam Carter.

3 MS. CARTER: Thank you, Your Honour.

4 WITNESS: NEDZIB DOZO

5 [Witness answered through interpreter]

6 Examination by Ms. Carter:

7 Q. Mr. Dozo, will you please introduce yourself to the Court.

8 A. My name is Dozo Nedzib. I was born on 4th of May, 1958, in the

9 place called Batina, Pale municipality, Republic of Bosnia and

10 Herzegovina.

11 Q. During the war what job did you hold?

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Mr. Dozo, were you involved in the war at all?

13 THE WITNESS: [Interpretation] When the war broke out, I came to

14 the police station in the Stari Grad municipality where I worked as a

15 policeman.

16 MS. CARTER: Thank you, sir.

17 Q. Prior to today, you have testify in the Dragomir Milosevic case.

18 Is that correct?

19 A. Yes.

20 Q. And, for the record, Your Honour, the transcript of that

21 testimony of 14 March 2007 bears the 65 ter number 9422.

22 On Monday, your transcript was read back to you in a language you

23 understood. Is that correct?

24 A. Yes.

25 Q. And you indicated that you had a few clarifications to that

Page 4516

1 transcript. Is that correct?

2 A. Yes.

3 Q. Specifically, you indicated at page 3680, line 21, where the name

4 D-a-r-t-e-l-j-e was incorrect, and it should read D-a-t-e-l-j-i. Is that

5 correct?

6 A. Yes.

7 Q. You also indicated that you did not understand the translation at

8 page 3686, line 2, in which the English reads "to the house that was

9 shown us where billed Selmanovic." However, you were satisfied with the

10 further question and answer that that was clarified.

11 Is that correct?

12 A. Yes.

13 Q. You also indicated at page 3688, line 22, that the word

14 "G-o-r-d-o-n-j" was incorrect and should be "G-r-d-o-n-j-a."

15 Is that correct?

16 A. Yes.

17 Q. Lastly you indicated at page 3690 at line 3, the term "line of

18 sight" should have read "line of fire." Is that correct?

19 A. Yes.

20 Q. After those clarifications, if you were asked those same

21 questions today, would your answers be the same?

22 A. Yes.

23 MS. CARTER: Your Honours, I tender 65 ter number 9422 into

24 evidence.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted into evidence. May it please be

Page 4517

1 given an exhibit number.

2 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1936, Your Honours.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

4 Yes, Madam Carter.

5 MS. CARTER: Thank you, Your Honour.

6 Q. Within that transcript, several exhibits were tendered through

7 you. First of all, your statement of 22 November 1995 was admitted as

8 P363, at page 3683, with clarifications regarding paragraph 8. With that

9 clarification, do you adopt that same statement here today?

10 A. Yes.

11 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, the Prosecution tenders 65 ter number

12 9420 into evidence.

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter, do we have the clarifications? Are

14 we going to be able see the clarifications when we look at the statement?

15 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, the clarifications are actually made

16 within the body of the D. Milosevic transcript on that page.

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: I thought you were talking here about

18 clarifications to P363 which is his statement.

19 MS. CARTER: 363 is his statement. However when they tendered it

20 as a 92 ter package within the D. Milosevic case, they provided

21 clarification within the transcript.

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okay. Thank you so much, ma'am.

23 MS. CARTER: Thank you, Your Honour.

24 JUDGE MOLOTO: What are we admitting? Are we admitting P363 of

25 Milosevic as an exhibit here? Or do have you a 65 ter number for this?

Page 4518

1 MS. CARTER: The 65 ter in this case is 9420.

2 JUDGE MOLOTO: 9420. And you have tendered it.

3 MS. CARTER: Yes, Your Honour.

4 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted. May it please be given an exhibit

5 number.

6 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1937, Your Honours.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you so much.

8 MS. CARTER:

9 Q. Further, your statement of 21 April 2005 was admitted as P364,

10 and that was done, again, at page 3683. However, during your proofing on

11 Monday, you indicated that had you a clarification to make with regards

12 to paragraph 8. Is that correct?

13 A. Yes.

14 Q. Okay. Specifically, you indicated that that paragraph should be

15 fully redacted. And in its place it should read:

16 "In August 1995, I heard a shell hit a street. A shell makes a

17 different sound when it hits a street rather than a building. Moments

18 later I arrived at the police station in Stari Grad which was 30 to 40

19 metres away. My supervisor advised me that a shell hit outside Markale

20 market.

21 "Two or three cars from the station went to the market to

22 transport the wounded. The market is outside our station's area, so I

23 was not involved in the technical investigation. I may have gone to the

24 market to assist at a later time, but all wounded had already been taken

25 away before I arrived. Later, we watched television footage of the dead

Page 4519

1 and wounded. I took some follow-up statements at a later date."

2 And I do apologise, Your Honour, I identified that as being a

3 replacement for paragraph 8. That should actually be a replacement for

4 paragraph 5.

5 Sir, with that clarification made, do you adopt that statement

6 here today?

7 A. I do.

8 MS. CARTER: I tender 65 ter number 9421 into evidence.

9 JUDGE MOLOTO: That's admitted. May it please be given an

10 exhibit number.

11 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1938, Your Honours.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

13 MS. CARTER:

14 Q. Lastly, the on-site investigation report of 14 December 1994 was

15 also admitted as P367 at page 3693. Do you adopt that report as well

16 here today?

17 A. Yes.

18 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, I tender 65 ter number 8614 into

19 evidence.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: That's admitted.

21 May it please be given an exhibit number.

22 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1939, Your Honours.

23 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

24 MS. CARTER: Before turning to the direct examination, I will

25 read out a summary of the witness's evidence:

Page 4520

1 Since 1992 Nedzib Dozo has been a police officer serving in the

2 old town area of Sarajevo known as Stari Grad.

3 His evidence is related to his investigation into a large number

4 of crimes, including sniping and shelling incidents, as well as air

5 bombs.

6 Mr. Dozo will provide specific evidence related to the sniping

7 incident B-9 of 10 December 1994, where civilians were fired upon from

8 Spicaste, S-p-i-c-a-s-t-a; second word, Stijena, S-t-i-j-e-n-a; as well

9 as the shelling incident A-4 of 22 December 1994, where two shells landed

10 in a flea market; as well as investigations of shelling predating but

11 relating to the shelling incident A-9 of 28 August 1995, colloquially

12 known as Markale II.

13 Q. Mr. Dozo, the last exhibit that we discussed with regard to your

14 Dragomir Milosevic testimony related to incident B-9 where an on-site

15 investigation was performed relating to a sniping victim,

16 Dervisa Selmanovic; is that correct?

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: Mr. Lukic.

18 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] I'm a bit taken by surprise because

19 we thought that this witness was a 92 ter witness, so unless there is

20 some special reasons there should be any examination-in-chief. My

21 learned friend has not explained why she wants to examine in chief this

22 witness, so I wonder whether there is some deviation from the rule that

23 is well established.

24 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter.

25 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, as Defence I'm sure is aware, we have

Page 4521

1 actually requested for an hour and a half of life testimony to be taken

2 from this witness in order to take clarifications and highlighting of

3 certain aspects of his testimony. We will be asking questions in

4 relation to all three incidents which are not contained within his 92 ter

5 materials. And we believe that it would assist the Court in the final

6 determination of these crimes.

7 JUDGE MOLOTO: Any response, Mr. Lukic?

8 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Yes, Your Honours.

9 In relation to certain witnesses, when the Prosecution wanted to

10 have examination-in-chief, they requested that their status be changed

11 from 92 ter to viva voce witnesses. And if this witness is now examined

12 in chief, that means that his status has been changed, and we have not

13 been inform about this.

14 As far as we know, this witness came as a 92 ter witness. We

15 have received material and his previous testimony, transcript of it, and

16 that's what we were expecting.

17 This is a complete surprise for us now.

18 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter, paragraph 21 of our guidelines, you

19 have complied with, and it doesn't look to me like unless you have made

20 prior arrangements with your colleagues you have any further rights to

21 lead the witness. I beg your pardon, sorry, I apologise.

22 Mr. Lukic, the same paragraph, does allow her to do a limited

23 examination to clarify or highlight particular aspects of the statement.

24 So she would be allowed to do so.

25 You may proceed, Madam Carter.

Page 4522

1 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, just to advise the Chamber as well that

2 on 26 September 2008 when we tendered the submission a revised witness

3 list with confidential Annex A, witness Dozo was listed as number 76 as a

4 92 ter witness, but we specifically indicated that the estimated hours of

5 examination-in-chief was one half hours. So I just want to clarify that

6 for the record since Defence counsel had indicated that they had no prior

7 warning that this witness would be led live. And I will continue with my

8 examination.

9 Q. Sir, I'd like to address first incident B-9 that took place in

10 December of 1994.

11 You provided in your previous transcript an on-site investigation

12 report of 14 December 1994. When you originally came on-site who was

13 providing information with regards to the sniping of Dervisa Selmanovic?

14 A. As far as for the manner of shooting and the location of it, we

15 were informed about it by the neighbours of Mrs. Selmanovic. The locals.

16 When this incident took place, they managed to get her out from the area

17 where she had been wounded to pull her out of it. And then with the help

18 of UNPROFOR, they transported her to the Kosevo Hospital where she was

19 admitted.

20 Q. At some later point, did you have an opportunity to speak with

21 Ms. Dervisa Selmanovic?

22 A. That day when that incident happened when she was wounded, I

23 didn't manage to talk to her, to interview her on that day.

24 Q. Did you have the opportunity to interview her on any day?

25 A. Yes, three months later, approximately three months later. It

Page 4523

1 was only then that we managed to locate her because she had moved out of

2 the house where she resided to another municipality, to Centar

3 municipality. And it wasn't until three months later that we managed to

4 locate her.

5 MS. CARTER: I would ask for 65 ter 8614 to be brought up into

6 e-court.

7 My apologies, Your Honour. Actually, it should be 65 ter 2640.

8 Q. Sir, do you recognise the document before you?

9 A. Yes.

10 Q. What is the document?

11 A. This is an Official Note, after the interview with

12 Ms. Selmanovic, which was drawn up by myself, and I sent it on to the

13 police station, and from there, it went to the relevant unit.

14 Q. And just for clarity of the record, within the December 1994

15 report it was indicated that her left leg was shot. However, in the 1995

16 report, it said it was her right.

17 Can you please explain this difference.

18 A. The day that she was wounded I was duty police officer in the

19 police station, and the head of the shift was called by residents who

20 told him that there was some shooting from Spicaste Stijena, as a result

21 of which a female person was wounded. Later on we learned that it was

22 Mrs. Selmanovic.

23 Also, the person who reported the incident to the police station

24 said that she had been wounded in her left leg. Since neither I nor the

25 on-site investigation team managed to talk to Mrs. Selmanovic, because we

Page 4524

1 hadn't been able to locate her, we simply noted that down, based on what

2 we had heard from the neighbours, who also said that she had been wounded

3 in the left leg. I guess they were scared, under stress, and that's what

4 they reported to us.

5 Later on, when I managed to locate her and find where she lived,

6 we interviewed her, and it turned out she said to us and it was also

7 supported by the doctor's report that she had been wounded in her right

8 leg. And this is what we wrote down in the Official Note then.

9 Q. Thank you, sir.

10 I would now like to move on to the incident A-4, which was the

11 shelling incident of the flea market on 22 December 1994.

12 Did you take part in that investigation?

13 A. Yes. As a member of the on-site investigation team.

14 [Trial Chamber confers]

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: Mr. Lukic. Sorry I am still having some problems

16 here. So my mind has taken --

17 Yes, Mr. Lukic.

18 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, once again, I will

19 reiterate my previous objection, with another explanation.

20 All of the questions that we have heard so far from my learned

21 friend have been covered in previous testimonies and statements. We

22 haven't heard anything new, in addition to what can be filed in the 92

23 ter package. If the Prosecutor wants an explanation in accordance with

24 Rule 21, they need to precede each of their questions with the

25 explanation of what it is that they're exactly seeking from the witness

Page 4525

1 that is in addition to the 92 ter package. If you were to look at the

2 92 ter package, you would see that everything that has been elicited from

3 the witness so far is included in that package. There is nothing new.

4 No new information there.

5 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter.

6 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, I'm not clear what package the Defence

7 counsel is reviewing. There were --

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Reviewing the 92 ter package. That's what he is

9 talking about.

10 MS. CARTER: And if he were, the fact that the exhibit that I

11 just tendered is not found within the 92 ter package, would indicate that

12 this is in fact new information.

13 I will concede that there is an aspect where there was some

14 discussion within the portions of the package, specifically the

15 transcript, where the left leg/right leg difference was noted; however,

16 because dealing with a new exhibit that was not addressed within that old

17 package. I felt that I needed to clarify and to highlight that point.

18 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes. But this confusion about which leg was

19 injured, was it not -- is it not already contained in the -- in the

20 92 ter package?

21 MS. CARTER: Very minimally, Your Honour. And because there is

22 no citation to the 1995 report in the 92 ter package, I felt in order to

23 have a complete record, we needed to relate the two documents to each

24 other and this would be how we would do it.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Notwithstanding that you gave notice to your

Page 4526

1 colleagues that you are going to lead this witness for one and a half

2 hours, the rule gives you limited leading. You are still subject to

3 limited leading. You may not necessarily have the entire one and a half

4 hours.

5 MS. CARTER: Certainly, Your Honours.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: Okay.

7 MS. CARTER:

8 Q. Sir, were you a part of the investigation of the shelling of the

9 flea market on 22 December 1994?

10 A. Yes, I was a member of the team.

11 MS. CARTER: I would ask that 65 ter 1439B be brought up into

12 e-court.

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: Just before we do that, was 2640 admitted?

14 MS. CARTER: Apologies, Your Honour. I did not ask for 2640 to

15 be tendered. I do so now.

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: 65 ter 2640 is admitted into evidence.

17 May it please be given an exhibit number.

18 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1940, Your Honours.

19 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

20 [Trial Chamber and registrar confer]

21 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter, it is break time. Would it be a

22 convenient if we took a break and let the technician work on this?

23 MS. CARTER: Certainly, Your Honour.

24 JUDGE MOLOTO: We take a break and come back at quarter to 6.00.

25 Court adjourned.

Page 4527

1 --- Recess taken at 5.17 p.m.

2 --- On resuming at 5.45 p.m.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Madam Carter.

4 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, in the break I determined that I'm

5 going to re-order the testimony, and so I'd now like to move on to

6 testimony related to scheduled incident A-9, and I would ask that 65 ter

7 number 9244.01 be brought up into e-court.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Are you abandoning 1439B?

9 MS. CARTER: For the time being, Your Honour. I will pick it up

10 again later.

11 Can this exhibit be expanded to full screen. There we go.

12 Q. Sir, in your statement, that has been admitted as P1938, you

13 refer to several investigations related to shellings that predated the

14 Markale II incident of August 1995. I would ask you to look at the

15 exhibit that's before you.

16 Do you recognise the area depicted in this map?

17 A. Yes. This is one part of the so-called old town and one part of

18 the so-called Centar municipality.

19 Q. Okay. With the assistance of the usher, I would ask you to make

20 a few markings on this map.

21 Can you first mark on the map the market which was hit on

22 5 February 1994. And when you locate it, if you can mark it with A-3.

23 A. [Marks]

24 Q. Okay. In addition, can you also please mark the market that was

25 hit on 28 August 1995 and mark that with an A-9.

Page 4528

1 A. It's very close some 50 to 100 metres away from this place, in

2 the same street.

3 Q. Thank you, sir.

4 MS. CARTER: I would like to have a screen shot taken of this

5 image and it be tendered into evidence.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: It's admitted into evidence.

7 May it please be given an exhibit number.

8 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1941, Your Honours.

9 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

10 MS. CARTER: Okay.

11 Q. Now I'd like to elaborate on paragraph 9 of that -- of your 1995

12 statement, in relation to the same map. You indicated that there was a

13 single shelling that took place on a day near Markale market.

14 Can you just tell us when exactly did this shelling take place,

15 the singular one?

16 A. Which particular shelling are you referring to? Or are you

17 talking about Markale II or Markale 1?

18 Q. I'm -- in reference to your statement, you indicated that there

19 was one incident where there was a single shelling and another incident

20 where there was three shellings that came in quick succession. I want to

21 deal first with the shelling that took place individually.

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Lukic.

23 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Maybe my learned friend should refer

24 to a particular paragraph in the statement. That would allow the witness

25 to understand the question, because some things may be lost in

Page 4529

1 translation.

2 So maybe my learned friend should go to the statement and refer

3 the witness to the paragraph in the statement.

4 JUDGE MOLOTO: [Previous translation continues] ... understand

5 the question, sir?

6 THE WITNESS: [Interpretation] Yes.

7 May I? May I answer?

8 MS. CARTER:

9 Q. Certainly, sir. Can you please tell me when did the singular

10 incident take place in relation to the August 28th Markale market

11 shelling?

12 A. Before Markale II, which was on 28 August -- or, rather, that

13 incident happened in the morning, around 11.00, 11.30, approximately.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: Which incident is it? The one of the 28th of

15 August?

16 THE WITNESS: [Interpretation] Yes, yes.

17 MS. CARTER:

18 Q. I think things are getting lost in translation, sir.

19 Okay. I'm not talking about the Markale II incident. But there

20 are two paragraphs in Exhibit P1938, in which you indicate: "To begin,

21 there's something more interesting to tell. I was part of the

22 investigation team that investigated some shellings short before the big

23 shelling of Markale on 28 August 1995."

24 So I want to talk about those investigations.

25 Now you have broken it up in your statement between two separate

Page 4530

1 periods: One with three shellings, one with a singular shelling. I want

2 to start with the one that is a singular shelling.

3 Can you please tell me when that singular shelling took place.

4 A. I can't remember the exact day when that happened, but it was

5 before the Markale II shelling. I went for an on-site inspection, in the

6 immediate vicinity of the street -- or, rather, the Markale market, and

7 we were able to establish that two or three shells had been fired from

8 the area known as Barice in the north. The shells fell on the Geneta

9 [phoen] Cikma Street across the street from the Markale market. Two or

10 three children fell victim. I'm not sure how many. Actually, I don't

11 know whether any of them died. However, everything pointed to the fact

12 that the shells had been fired in the direction of the Markale market.

13 Q. Now, I understand that you can't give me a specific date, but can

14 you tell me was it within a year, within six months, within a month,

15 within weeks? Can you give us some approximation?

16 A. Approximately a month before that shelling.

17 MS. CARTER: I would actually like to have P1941 with the

18 markings that the witness made on screen, please.

19 JUDGE MOLOTO: Doesn't look like the markings are still there.

20 MS. CARTER: If they're not, I can certainly undergo the exercise

21 again.

22 JUDGE MOLOTO: What did you want to do with that?

23 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, I'm going to have the witness identify

24 where the shelling landed that injured these children.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: So you're going to give it another number.

Page 4531

1 MS. CARTER: Yes, Your Honour.

2 Q. And with the help of the usher, sir, can you please identify on

3 this map where the children were injured that you just spoke of?

4 A. [Marks]

5 Q. I see that you have drawn a bit of a star figure just above A-3.

6 Are you indicating that that's the location where the children were

7 injured?

8 If I can get a verbal response, please.

9 A. Yes.

10 Q. Thank you. Then can you please mark that star with a C.

11 A. [Marks]

12 Q. Okay. Thank you, sir.

13 MS. CARTER: I'd ask a screen shot be taken of this image and it

14 be tendered into evidence.

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: Admitted.

16 May it please be given an exhibit number.

17 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1942, Your Honours.

18 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

19 MS. CARTER:

20 Q. Sir, through the investigations of that event, did you determine

21 what the direction of fire was?

22 A. Yes. It was established that the shells had arrived from the

23 direction north, from the settlements of Barice and Mrkovici or rather

24 the neighbourhoods with those names.

25 Q. Who controlled that area?

Page 4532

1 A. The Serb forces.

2 Q. Okay. Thank you, sir. Now I'd like to bring P1941 back on

3 screen. And we're going turn now to the series of three shellings that

4 took place.

5 Sir, did the series of three shellings happen on the same day as

6 the shelling that we were just referring to?

7 A. No, not on the same day. It was either before or after, one or

8 two days before or after, but I'm not sure.

9 Q. Thank you. Now you said that three shells -- there were three

10 shellings that day. Can you please describe what was hit with the first

11 shelling?

12 A. The first shell exploded in the street that was once called

13 something, and I don't remember what it was called, but nowadays it is

14 Skenderija Street, very close to a bridge and very close to a secondary

15 school that is located there. And I know that one young man died there.

16 He was a student at the school of political sciences.

17 Q. Do you see the location where the student was hit on the map

18 before you?

19 A. Yes.

20 Q. With the assistance of the usher, I would ask that, in a

21 different colour, you place a number 1 where the student was killed, or

22 injured, pardon.

23 A. [Marks]

24 Q. You also indicated that there was a second shelling. Can you

25 please describe what was hit during the second shelling?

Page 4533

1 A. The second shell hit the then JNA street, as it was known then,

2 and today it is known as the defender of Sarajevo street. In front of

3 the building of the Stari Grad municipality. I don't know whether

4 anybody was killed there. I know that there were several wounded. Among

5 them there was a foreigner who was an employee of a humanitarian or a

6 charitable organisation that was, at the time, involved in the

7 installation of gas pipes in Sarajevo.

8 Q. I would ask you to place a number 2 where these men were injured.

9 A. [Marks]

10 Q. Okay. Now, you indicated there was a third shelling on that day.

11 What occurred at that shelling?

12 A. The third shell fell in Mula Mustafe Baseskije Street, which was

13 then known as Marsal Tito Street. And it hit the wall of the so-called

14 Konzum building. It was a food store. I know for sure that one person

15 was killed, that several persons were wounded on that occasion. And I

16 know that the person who was killed by the shell, the situation was

17 rather gruesome. We found a complete brain scattered on the street after

18 the shelling.

19 Q. Can you please mark with a 3 the location of this shelling?

20 A. [Marks]

21 MS. CARTER: And I would ask that a screen shot be taken of this

22 exhibit and it be tendered into evidence.

23 JUDGE MOLOTO: It is admitted into evidence. May it please be

24 given an exhibit number.

25 THE REGISTRAR: That will be Exhibit P1943, Your Honours.

Page 4534

1 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

2 MS. CARTER: I will be asking with no further markings. The rest

3 will be led with the testimony. Okay.

4 Q. Sir, can you please advise us how close to the Markale market was

5 the third shelling?

6 A. The third shell fell not more than 30 metres away from there.

7 Q. And how far did the second shell fall from the third shell?

8 A. The first shell fell in the Suceska Street, the next one in the

9 JNA street, and the distance between the two is about 100 metres, and the

10 third shell fell at about the same distance to the previous two.

11 Q. Okay.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: I don't understand the last answer [Microphone not

13 activated]

14 MS. CARTER: I will clarify, Your Honour.

15 Q. Okay. We'll just start again from the first shell.

16 How far was the first shell to Markale?

17 A. The first shell hit a place up to 250 or 300 metres away from

18 Markale, not more than that.

19 Q. And how close was the second shelling to Markale?

20 A. The shells fell at a distance of some 100 metres from each other.

21 The second shell hit a place that was about 150 to 200 metres away, not

22 more than that.

23 Q. And when you say "away," are you referring away from the Markale

24 market?

25 A. I'm referring to a distance between the place where the shell

Page 4535

1 exploded and the Markale.

2 Q. And just to confirm, you indicated that the third shelling took

3 place between about 30 and 50 metres from the Markale market. Is that

4 correct?

5 A. Yes. A third shell hit the same street, Mula Mustafe Baseskije,

6 which was then known as Marsal Tito Street. And the distance between the

7 place where it exploded and Markale market is not more than 30 metres.

8 If anything, it is probably less than 30 metres.

9 Q. Okay, sir. In your statement, you certainly have a strong

10 opinion as to what was occurring with these shellings. And you indicate

11 that those opinions are based on the fact that you had been a mortar

12 platoon commander in the JNA. I'd like to explore that a little bit with

13 you.

14 Can you please tell me when were you in the JNA, as a mortar

15 commander?

16 A. I served in the JNA in 1980, in Banja Luka, and there, I was

17 first trained as a soldier; then a non-commissioned officer; and then I

18 was assigned to be a commander of a platoon; and, finally, when I left

19 the army what was written in my military booklet was that I was a

20 commander of the mortar platoon.

21 Q. What training did you receive in order to become a mortar

22 commander?

23 A. First, I operated the 82-millimetre mortar, and then I became a

24 non-commissioned officer. I was a corporal. Then I was first trained as

25 a platoon commander. But when I worked on mortar, I was operating the

Page 4536

1 sight -- the sighting device.

2 Q. And that's what I'm trying to explore a bit about. Can you

3 please tell us what kind of education or training did you undergo in

4 order to hold these positions?

5 A. I had to undergo a complete training. I had to get familiar with

6 the weaponry, its use, and then I had to practice targeting.

7 Q. When you say you were practicing targeting, what does that mean?

8 A. That means that we practiced with shells, real shells. We were

9 given a target, and we were supposed to hit it. That's what we were

10 trained to do.

11 Q. How does one go about hitting a target?

12 A. There is a rule how you determine the angle, the distance. You

13 are trained how to hit a target by calculating your angle and by

14 calculating the distance.

15 Q. In regards to the succession of these three shells that we were

16 discussing before, how -- what was the time-frame in which all three hit?

17 A. The three shells fell within about half an hour from each other.

18 If the first one exploded around 10.00, then the third one probably

19 exploded around 10.30.

20 Q. With the lining of these as well as the timing, is that

21 consistent with the experience that you had sighting mortar, in the JNA?

22 A. It all depends on what you want to achieve, what you're aiming

23 for, and within what time. In any case, this was ample time to correct

24 fire in order to hit a target.

25 According to our experience in Sarajevo, what happened was one

Page 4537

1 shell would fall, then a certain period of time would pass, fire would be

2 corrected, and the subsequent shell would inflict more casualties.

3 Q. Based on your investigation of those three shellings, was a

4 determination made in regards to the direction of fire?

5 A. The shells came from the direction of Lukavica, or Vraca in the

6 Trebevic sector -- or, rather, from the slope of Trebevic, not from its

7 top and the slopes of Trebevic is where the neighbourhood of Lukavica was

8 located.

9 Q. Who controlled that territory?

10 A. Again, the Serb forces.

11 Q. Okay. I would now like to move to air bombs.

12 You indicated in your statement that you had some experience in

13 relation to those. Can you please tell me when is the first time that

14 you encountered an air bomb in Sarajevo?

15 A. I can't remember the exact date when that happened. However, we

16 had received information that in the canyon of Muscanice [phoen] river, a

17 modified rocket had fallen. We didn't know what this was all about. And

18 when we went to the site we found an air bomb which had been modified, to

19 carry four more rocket motors. And I believe that this had been fired

20 from a multi-rocket-launcher. It never exploded. It just fell between

21 some rocks. And the ignition device missed and failed to activate. I

22 know that after that, people who were experts in explosives managed to

23 take out about 90 kilos of explosives from that unexploded bomb.

24 Q. What kind of damage can 90 kilos of explosive do?

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes, Mr. Lukic.

Page 4538

1 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] I don't know whether this witness is

2 qualified to supply an answer.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter.

4 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, based upon his experience of being a

5 commander in a mortar unit he would certainly -- should certainly be able

6 to answer, and if he wouldn't, he would, I believe, advise us of that.

7 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] I think that his experience with a

8 mortar platoon has nothing in common with an air bomb.

9 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, as we've heard testimony repeatedly

10 that an air bomb merely is a mortar with rockets attached to it. The

11 load, the specific explosive load is related to the mortar aspects of

12 which he would be experienced.

13 JUDGE MOLOTO: I have a more fundamental problem, Madam Carter.

14 And it doesn't arise on there question only. It has arisen a couple of

15 minutes ago. You're leading this witness like is he an expert witness.

16 Is he an expert witness?

17 MS. CARTER: No, Your Honour. However, he has given opinions,

18 lay opinions within his witness statement. And I'm just trying to

19 provide the context in which he is making them.

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: And precisely because of that, what's the law

21 about opinions of laypeople? Are they admissible?

22 MS. CARTER: They certainly are admissible; however, the Court

23 would not rely upon them the same way as they would rely upon an expert

24 witness.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Do laypeople give opinion evidence, ma'am?

Page 4539

1 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, I think people give their opinions all

2 the time in regards to what happened. We can't put ourselves in the mind

3 of the people who are firing upon us.

4 JUDGE MOLOTO: I'm not asking you about what people do. I'm

5 asking you about the law. Does the law say laypeople give opinion

6 evidence?

7 MS. CARTER: I would have to fully brief that, Your Honour. I

8 know it has been the practice of the cases in which I have been a part

9 of, that they have been allowed to give opinion evidence. As to what

10 their basic experience is, they certainly would not be able to then

11 extrapolate on some other area of Sarajevo or some other incident that he

12 didn't have personal knowledge about. And that's what makes the

13 difference. An expert able to extrapolate on things that he didn't have

14 personal dealings with, as opposed to this witness is merely talking

15 about those matters which he did deal with.

16 JUDGE MOLOTO: Yes. But did he deal with determining the amount

17 of damage that a 90-kilo air bomb can cause? Did he deal with that

18 90-kilo air bomb that was there, that he found -- that was found in the

19 rocks?

20 MS. CARTER: He is indicating that he certainly did. And given

21 the fact that he was responsible for many investigations in regards to

22 sniping and shelling within Sarajevo, I believe that he would be in a

23 position to be able to answer that question.

24 However, I can withdraw it if the court feels that it is not

25 helpful to its determination.

Page 4540

1 JUDGE MOLOTO: I don't think it is very helpful, ma'am.

2 MS. CARTER: Okay. Certainly, Your Honour.

3 Q. Sir, outside of this air bomb, did you encounter any others

4 during your time in Sarajevo?

5 A. Well, we conducted on-site investigations of all shells which

6 landed and exploded in the territory of our municipality. So from gun

7 rounds, 82-millimetres, mortars, Howitzers, 120-millimetres, mortar

8 shells, and so on. And I know that great damage was caused especially

9 when it comes to large-calibre mortar shells.

10 At that point in time, when we would arrive on site, what was

11 really important us was to establish the direction of firing, and that

12 indicated that this shell had been fired in the direction of Stari Grad,

13 old town.

14 Q. I'd actually like to move back to the question. We know that

15 your statement, that you did investigate one air bomb. Is that the only

16 air bomb that you encountered during your time in Stari Grad?

17 A. Yes.

18 Q. Based on the investigation of that air bomb, do you have any

19 information as regards to who fired?

20 A. As far as I am aware, we, the army of Bosnia and Herzegovina, did

21 not have such weaponry. So these air bombs could only have been fired

22 from the positions under the control of the army of Republika Srpska.

23 Q. You just indicated "we," in relation to the army of Bosnia and

24 Herzegovina. Were you a member of the military, or were you a member of

25 the police force?

Page 4541

1 A. No. I was a member of police force.

2 Q. All right. Now I would like to move back to the incident that

3 took place in the flea market.

4 Sir, did you assist in the investigation of that flea market

5 shelling?

6 A. Yes. I was a member of the team which conducted on-site

7 investigation.

8 Q. Okay. When you say you were part of a team, who makes up that

9 team?

10 A. There was an investigating judge, who led the investigation, was

11 in charge of it; then there were officials from the homicide unit of the

12 Sarajevo cantonal MUP; and then there were crime technicians from the

13 Sarajevo cantonal MUP; and also officials from the crime prevention unit

14 of Stari Grad.

15 Q. Which type of individual were you, in relation to that

16 investigation?

17 A. When there is a shelling incident, it is usually the uniformed

18 policemen who secure the location. Following that, an on-site

19 investigation team usually arrives, led by an investigating judge. Our

20 task, my colleague and I, who represented the Stari Grad police, were

21 there to work under the orders of the investigating judge to locate the

22 traces of explosion, traces of a shell that had exploded, and then

23 following that, crime technicians would arrive to take photographs of the

24 site. And then on the orders of the police, that would be secured and

25 isolated, and analysis would be conducted, and then the entire material

Page 4542

1 would be forwarded to the investigating judge for further proceedings.

2 Q. And just to make sure I know where in that answer your role

3 ended, you indicated that you were to look for the traces of explosion,

4 traces of a shell that had exploded.

5 Now is that your entire role? And then somebody else takes on

6 the job from there?

7 A. Yes.

8 Q. Are you familiar with the official reports that are drawn up,

9 based on this type of investigation?

10 A. A judge is in charge of it, and then a report is drawn up by the

11 police officials from the homicide unit.

12 MS. CARTER: I would ask that 65 ter number 1439B be brought up

13 into e-court. And I believe Defence counsel is on his feet.

14 JUDGE MOLOTO: Mr. Lukic.

15 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] It seems to me that we have not

16 received an answer to the question that was just put to the witness.

17 JUDGE MOLOTO: [Microphone not activated] ... Are you interested

18 in getting the answer, ma'am, or ...

19 MS. CARTER: I can --

20 JUDGE MOLOTO: We just want to know, are you interested?

21 MS. CARTER: I thought he had answered. I do apologise.

22 Q. Sir, are you familiar with the types of reports that are drawn up

23 after an investigation such as this?

24 A. Yes.

25 MS. CARTER: And I would ask that this exhibit be taken to page 2

Page 4543

1 in the English and page 5 in the B/C/S.

2 Q. Sir, I see on the official report, there is a listing of ten

3 individuals who worked on this investigation, with your name following as

4 number 10. Are you familiar with the other gentlemen who took part in

5 this investigation?

6 A. Yes.

7 Q. And during your proofing session, did you have the opportunity to

8 review this file?

9 A. Yes.

10 Q. Do you believe that this file is a true and accurate depiction of

11 the investigation that was performed in relation to the 22 December 1994

12 shelling incident?

13 A. Yes.

14 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, at this time I am seeking to tender

15 this document. However, I do want to bring the Court's attention to the

16 fact that P415 is also a copy of this file. The English version is

17 complete in both 415 as well as in 65 ter 1439B. The discrepancy comes

18 in with regards to the B/C/S. The original exhibit P415 only contains

19 11 pages of the B/C/S. We had asked for guidance and received it that we

20 could not add those additional pages to the exhibit because it actually

21 had already been tendered and accepted by the Court.

22 So I would request that -- that these two exhibits be merged so

23 that we have a complete B/C/S and English copy, and would certainly, for

24 clarity of the record, like to maintain it as P415.

25 JUDGE MOLOTO: Any response, Mr. Lukic?

Page 4544

1 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] I haven't got a problem with it,

2 Your Honour. Whatever is the best technical solution.

3 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Carter, is this exhibit in both English and

4 B/C/S complete? This one. This one here.

5 MS. CARTER: The one before you is complete, Your Honour, yes.

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: Complete on both versions.

7 MS. CARTER: Correct, Your Honour.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Madam Registrar, this document here is admitted in

9 its entirety. Will it please replace Exhibit P415 -- and Exhibit P415 be

10 withdrawn completely, and this take the number P415.

11 THE REGISTRAR: Will do, Your Honours.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

13 MS. CARTER: And at this time, the Prosecution passes the

14 witness.

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you, Madam Carter.

16 Mr. Lukic.

17 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Thank you, Your Honours. Just a

18 moment please.

19 Cross-examination by Mr. Lukic:

20 Q. [Interpretation] Mr. Dozo, good afternoon.

21 A. Good afternoon.

22 Q. I am Defence counsel Novak Lukic, and I will be examining you on

23 behalf of the Defence team of Mr. Perisic. I would kindly ask you to

24 pause a bit before giving your answer, and I will do the same before

25 putting a new question so that the interpreters can follow us.

Page 4545

1 A. All right.

2 Q. First of all, I'd like to put a few questions to you concerning

3 what I will call the first incident, in Sedrenik where Selmanovic,

4 Dervisa was injured. At that time, you worked at the Stari Grad police

5 station. Correct?

6 A. Yes.

7 Q. What was your exact job position at the time?

8 A. I was an inspector in the crime prevention police unit.

9 Q. At the time, within your scope of duties, were you authorised to

10 file criminal reports?

11 A. Yes.

12 Q. These criminal reports or criminal complaints are normally sent

13 to the public prosecutor who has jurisdiction over it.

14 A. Yes.

15 Q. Your police station received information that in Sedrenik a woman

16 was injured, and at that time a team was set up within the police

17 station, which was to go to the location and to carry out an on-site

18 investigation?

19 A. Yes.

20 Q. How is such a team established or set up at the police station?

21 A. Once we receive information about an incident, the head of the

22 shift within the police station informs a judge about the incident.

23 Following that the cantonal MUP, which had technical equipment to

24 cover the entire city of Sarajevo and then within the forensics

25 department, they had a KDZ unit where there were ballistics experts

Page 4546

1 working. The judge would then authorise an inspector to go to the site

2 if he, the judge, wasn't able to go himself, and it would be the police

3 inspector from the police station in the territory where the incident

4 happened.

5 Once the on-site investigation is completed, then the inspector

6 is duty-bound to draw up the minutes or the report of the on-site

7 investigation, to complete it with photographs and to deliver all of that

8 together to the investigating judge.

9 Q. As far as I understand, the ballistics expert who joins you,

10 together with forensics experts, they come from the cantonal MUP?

11 A. Yes, it is the cantonal MUP, the CSB of Sarajevo.

12 Q. How much time normally elapse from the moment you learn of an

13 incident -- if you remember in this particular case, how much time was

14 needed for a team to be set up and to arrive at the site?

15 A. The setting up of the team itself was not a problem, but it was a

16 problem to go to the location, because there would be additional

17 shellings, usually. And sometimes it would take us two, three, four

18 hours before we were able to get to the location. Sometimes a judge

19 wasn't available because he was busy with other grave cases. And in

20 those instances he would authorise an inspector to go instead of him.

21 Q. In this particular case the officer on duty at the police station

22 was informed that this woman had been injured in her left leg.

23 A. Yes.

24 Q. And armed with this information, you went to the site?

25 A. Yes.

Page 4547

1 Q. At the site you did not find this injured woman?

2 A. No.

3 Q. You learned that she had been transported to the hospital.

4 A. Yes, to the hospital.

5 Q. And there, at the location, the neighbours described the incident

6 to you.

7 A. Yes.

8 Q. And they described to you where she stood when the incident

9 happened.

10 A. Yes. And we found some blood in that location.

11 Q. You didn't take any statements from them, did you?

12 A. No.

13 Q. You didn't manage to reach the location because of the shooting

14 that was going on at the time.

15 A. Yes. We were taking shelter behind the house where

16 Mrs. Selmanovic lived.

17 Q. And it was only from that location that you were able to take

18 photographs of the -- of the location where you had been informed she had

19 been injured?

20 A. Yes.

21 Q. Do you remember how many photographs were made on the occasion,

22 photographs of the actual site?

23 A. I can't remember.

24 Q. Do you remember later on, when you officially interviewed

25 Mrs. Selmanovic, did you show her the photographs of the site?

Page 4548

1 A. No, I didn't.

2 Q. Did you ask her to draw a sketch of the place where she had been

3 injured?

4 A. No.

5 Q. Do you remember when the on-site investigation was conducted, the

6 ballistics expert and the forensic technicians, what were doing?

7 A. They were taking photographs of the site. And based on the

8 accounts of neighbours, we tried to establish where the shooting had come

9 from.

10 Q. And based on the accounts of neighbours, you obtained information

11 that you then recorded in the on-site investigation report?

12 A. Yes.

13 Q. However, you never interviewed or took statements from those

14 people.

15 A. No. We didn't manage to. We were not able to take statements

16 from the people right there on the location. We had to tell them to come

17 to the police station. And it was war-time, and it was difficult for

18 people to come to the police station.

19 Q. Were there a number of such cases where you drew up on-site

20 investigation reports without taking statements from eye-witnesses?

21 A. Seldom.

22 Q. Do you remember whether the ballistics expert who was present

23 wrote a report? Normally he does that when his finding is requested.

24 A. Ballistics experts and forensic technicians were not from my

25 police station; they were from the cantonal MUP. So they never provided

Page 4549

1 any reports to me. At least I didn't see any reports.

2 Q. The person who files a criminal complaint or report, isn't that

3 person duty-bound to collect all documents that accompany such a report?

4 A. At the time we did not file criminal reports against unknown

5 perpetrators. It was something that an investigating judge was supposed

6 to do, because he would later receive all the relevant documentation,

7 together.

8 Q. So you provided your portion of the paperwork, the Official Note,

9 and the report, you provided that three months later, and you supposed

10 that the ballistics expert and the forensic technicians provided their

11 reports?

12 A. Yes.

13 Q. And you had no idea about what they had written in their reports?

14 A. No.

15 Q. From there you went to the hospital, you found a doctor, on duty,

16 you entered his name in to your Official Note. Do you remember that?

17 A. Yes.

18 Q. In order to avoid any confusion -- just bear with me for a

19 moment, please.

20 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Can the Court please produce

21 Exhibit P1939.

22 And can we please zoom in on the bottom part of the document.

23 Q. So this is a note on the on-site inspection of the incident that

24 took place on the 9th of December 1994?

25 A. Yes.

Page 4550

1 Q. It says here in the penultimate paragraph she was transported by

2 a vehicle to the Kosevo clinical Hospital, and there she received medical

3 assistance at the orthopaedic department. She was sent home for

4 treatment after her wound had been dressed. According to

5 Dr. Fuad Dzankovic her wound was not serious.

6 Has this jogged your memory, do you remember now that you spoke

7 to the doctor who was on duty at the time?

8 A. Yes, yes. When we completed our investigation, we went to the

9 hospital to look for the lady. And the doctor had admitted here was able

10 to ascertain that the wound was not serious, and he discharged her.

11 Q. Did you ask the doctor to provide you with a report about the

12 nature of her wounds?

13 A. No. At the time nobody did that. We did not ask for medical

14 findings. The medical findings were given to the lady, and she took them

15 with her.

16 Q. Did you ask the doctor to show you anything in writing about the

17 type of wound and what leg was wounded?

18 A. I only remember that at the time that he told us that it was a

19 slight injury, nothing else.

20 Q. Did you inform him that your information -- according to your

21 information it was the left leg.

22 A. No, I can't remember that at the moment.

23 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Can we with scroll up just a little.

24 I have one more question. It will be brief. For that, I would like to

25 see the upper portion of the document.

Page 4551

1 Q. This on-site investigation report was compiled two days post

2 festum?

3 A. Yes. On the 14th of December and the -- and the incident took

4 place on the 12th.

5 Q. And the information about the wounded including the address

6 Zaima Sarca Street, who did you receive that from?

7 A. Probably from the doctor.

8 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Can the Court please produce P1940.

9 Q. Three months subsequently you were able to find the wounded

10 woman, not before. Am I right?

11 A. Yes.

12 Q. And you interviewed her at the police station?

13 A. Yes.

14 Q. This document shows that he -- that she was residing at the same

15 address that you entered into your investigation report.

16 A. However, the house number in this document is 57; whereas in the

17 previous report, there was no number because we were not aware of the

18 number of the house.

19 Q. Did you try in the meantime to go and look up her neighbours and

20 ask for their opinion an information?

21 A. They did not reside there, not all of them resided there at the

22 time. The times were dangerous. It was dangerous to live there.

23 Q. So you didn't go to Sedrenik once again to check on her?

24 A. The uniform police were in charge of that. They were in charge

25 of the area, and they were in charge of inspecting, and they were

Page 4552

1 supposed to find out whether the lady had returned to her former address

2 in Sedrenik.

3 Q. Is this a Sedrenik address? I apologise for asking. Are you

4 familiar with this name?

5 A. The street is Sedrenik or, rather, the Zaim Sarca Street, and it

6 does not depict a number.

7 Q. However, it is in the Sedrenik neighbourhood; is it not?

8 A. The Zaim Sarca Street is in centre municipality, not in Sedrenik.

9 Close to the hospital.

10 Q. When she told you that she had been wounded in the right leg,

11 which you then recorded in your Official Note, did you send that

12 information to the investigating judge?

13 A. Yes. By way of an Official Note.

14 Q. And again you didn't obtain any medical records to that effect?

15 A. No, I didn't. It is possible that -- that it does say so in the

16 report, but I don't remember that we had a camera or that we scanned the

17 document.

18 Q. I'm interested in something else that makes part of the

19 procedure. When your police station is informed that an incident

20 happened, you record some information, and on this particular occasion

21 the information that you recorded was that she was wounded in the left

22 leg. Is that correct?

23 A. [No interpretation]

24 Q. When information is obtained subsequently, is that information

25 entered in the log-book as well?

Page 4553

1 A. You're talking about the day in the log-book of daily events.

2 And if you're referring to that, we don't enter any subsequent

3 information into that daily log-book, the log-book of daily events.

4 Q. What you are saying is this: If the original information entered

5 into the log-book is that the --

6 JUDGE MOLOTO: [Previous translation continues] ...

7 MS. CARTER: Your Honour, I see in the transcript that there's

8 now an indication that we cannot distinguish between the question and the

9 answer. I would ask -- I suppose, it's a slowing-down issue. And also

10 can we get some differentiation, so we know who to attribute whatever

11 lines were at issue to either witness or to Defence counsel.

12 JUDGE MOLOTO: Counsel and witness, can be please slow down and

13 make sure you pause between each other's speeches.

14 Madam Carter is asking that we attribute words to people I'm not

15 quite sure whether you are able to do that, but if you are, please do

16 that.

17 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] I apologise to the interpreters. I

18 have tried to bear their work in mind, and I will try to control myself

19 and make the transcript as legible as possible.

20 Q. Mr. Dozo, if the original information is obtained and entered

21 into the log-book, and if according to that information, somebody was

22 killed and if it is learned subsequently that the original information

23 was not correct, the log-book, the original record in the log-book is not

24 subsequently corrected. Is that what you have told us?

25 A. It cannot happen that somebody got killed and that this -- that

Page 4554

1 such information is misrecorded.

2 Q. Let me be a bit more precise. There is a log-book at the police

3 station and somebody calls in and says that there was an incident with

4 casualties, with somebody who got killed. That is a possibility?

5 A. Yes.

6 Q. A team is sent to the site, they carry out an on-site inspection

7 and they obtain different information. Is the original information

8 corrected in the log-book that is kept at the station?

9 A. There's so little room in the log-book that you can only record

10 the original information that was obtained, that came in. If there are

11 drastic consequences, if a shell fell with a number of wounded, that is

12 recorded. At a later stage, three or four months later after many such

13 incidents happened, we never went back to subsequently change the

14 original data because the person who originally obtained the information

15 would have to record the subsequent information -- information could be

16 recorded by every officer on duty. The only valid document was an

17 Official Note, which was then submitted to the prosecutor. And that was

18 the only valid document that we always went by.

19 Q. That's correct. And only based on that document, one could know

20 how many people were indeed killed, or about reasonable suspicion that

21 somebody was killed.

22 A. Based on people calling in, we made a record of that person's

23 name, the person who called in, and then we recorded the information that

24 we obtained, especially if somebody got killed, because we also had to

25 inform the families of the people who were allegedly killed. We also

Page 4555

1 conducted hospital, morgues in order to ascertain whether it was that

2 particular person, that was really in question.

3 Q. You said that according to your information, in the area of

4 Sedrenik, between 50 and 100 people fell victim to sniping incidents.

5 That's what you have told us.

6 A. Sniping incidents and shelling combined, I believe. That would

7 be better said. This was not the only incident.

8 Q. You know and you participated in only one more case, where one

9 man had been hit by a sniper. That's what you testified.

10 A. Yes. And that person also died. I went to some on-site

11 inspections where there were no human casualties involved, but there was

12 damages to the houses.

13 Q. We're talking about human victims because that's part of your

14 testimony, and that's part of what has been recorded.

15 JUDGE MOLOTO: [Previous translation continues] ...

16 Yes, Mr. Lukic.

17 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation]

18 Q. In addition to the Dervisa Selmanovic case, you personally

19 participated in one more incident that involved human casualties in that

20 area.

21 A. Yes. The second incident was the one during which a man had been

22 killed, but I also participated in on-site investigations after sniper

23 fire had been opened on houses, but such incidents did not involve any

24 dead. There were people injured, however.

25 Q. You also did not have an insight into the book that could confirm

Page 4556

1 your statement that between 50 and 100 people got killed in that area.

2 A. That's because I never carried out any private investigations of

3 my own.

4 Q. I agree with you. We're testifying about the facts here. That's

5 why I'm asking you only about the facts.

6 You can't tell the Trial Chamber the name of any other person who

7 was killed or in that area during the war?

8 A. After so many years, I really can't remember the name of the

9 person who got killed in the incident that I investigated personally.

10 Q. The figure that you gave us is part of your assumption. Wouldn't

11 that be correct?

12 A. From the moment the aggression started to the moment the country

13 was reintegrated, there was no single day without sniper fire from

14 Spicaste Stijena. And every day people got targeted and killed in

15 Sedrenik, not only from sniper fire but also from shelling by mortars and

16 Howitzers.

17 Q. I asked you very specifically whether you are aware of any other

18 incidents besides the two that you participated in. Are you aware of any

19 other concrete incident, victim or a colleague of yours who participated

20 in an investigation of a very concrete incident?

21 A. I can't remember any.

22 Q. Thank you. Just a couple more questions about this topic.

23 As far as I could understand, when you described the positions of

24 the army of Bosnia and Herzegovina in Sedrenik in relation to Spicaste

25 Stijena, you said that it was impossible for the shots to have come from

Page 4557

1 the positions of the BiH army, because in that case their backs would be

2 turned to Spicaste Stijena?

3 A. No. Spicaste Stijena is an elevation about 900 metres above the

4 sea level, and that's -- hence its name. And below Spicaste Stijena

5 there is an rock and there's a meadow under that, and there you have this

6 neighbourhood or settlement. There were no positions of the BiH army

7 there, because it would have been too close. And the positions would

8 have been at the foot of Spicaste Stijena, and that would be about

9 20 metres distance from the very top. So they could have thrown rocks at

10 them. That's why the lines were moved left to Grdonja. And in the right

11 direction the positions were moved to a forest, the name of which I don't

12 know. That's where the lines were. But they were not exactly lines;

13 they were just two or three positions or protective bunkers of sorts that

14 protected the area from the onslaught of Serb forces towards Sedrenik.

15 Q. In your view, how far away is Spicaste Stijena from Sedrenik or

16 the location where that lady got wounded?

17 A. It is very close. I can't tell you exactly how close, but maybe,

18 as the crow flies, not more than 500 metres.

19 Q. The positions of the BH army in Sedrenik as far as I could

20 understand, were mostly manned by the locals, by people who resided

21 there.

22 A. 90 per cent were those people or somebody else. If the line had

23 to be reinforced, somebody would come from different areas.

24 Q. They were armed. Did they also have uniforms; do you remember?

25 A. Some did, and some were there in civilian clothes.

Page 4558

1 Q. However, when they were not on positions, they resided in

2 Sedrenik?

3 A. Some lived in Sedrenik, and the others lived in town. It all

4 depended on how resourceful they were.

5 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, I believe this is a

6 good time for -- to end our session today.

7 Q. Thank you very much, sir.

8 JUDGE MOLOTO: Thank you.

9 Sir, unfortunately, we have to knock off, but we are not done

10 with you. Can you, please, come back tomorrow at quarter past 2.00 again

11 in the afternoon in the same courtroom. And I warn that you while you

12 are still giving evidence, you may not discuss the case with anybody, not

13 even with your lawyers, okay.

14 Thank you so much.

15 Court adjourned tomorrow, quarter past 2.00 in the afternoon,

16 Courtroom II.

17 Court adjourned.

18 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 7.01 p.m.,

19 to be reconvened on Thursday, the 19th day of

20 March, 2009, at 2.15 p.m.