Page 13
1 Friday, 20 March 2009.
2 [Status Conference]
3 [Open session]
4 [The accused Zupljanin present]
5 --- Upon commencing at 2.17 p.m.
6 JUDGE STOLE: Good afternoon to everyone in the courtroom.
7 Mr. Registrar, would you call the case, please.
8 THE REGISTRAR: Yes, Your Honour. Good afternoon, Your Honour.
9 Good afternoon to everyone in and around the courtroom. This is the case
10 number IT-08-91-PT, The Prosecutor versus Mico Stanisic and
11 Stojan Zupljanin. Thank you, Your Honours.
12 JUDGE STOLE: And I welcome the Office of the Prosecutor, Defence
13 counsel, and one of the two accused. It's Zupljanin, as the other
14 accused Mico Stanisic is on provisional release.
15 Can the accused hear the proceedings? Can the accused hear the
16 proceedings in a language he understands? Is there a problem?
17 THE ACCUSED ZUPLJANIN: [Interpretation] I'm not receiving
18 interpretation.
19 JUDGE STOLE: You're not receiving interpretation. Oh.
20 Is it okay now?
21 THE ACCUSED ZUPLJANIN: [Interpretation] I cannot hear the
22 interpreters, and that's where the problem lies.
23 I can hear them now. I couldn't hear them before.
24 JUDGE STOLE: Let me know if there is any further problems. But
25 may we then proceed.
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1 THE INTERPRETER: Interpreter's note: Could the accused's
2 microphone please be switched off.
3 JUDGE STOLE: Yes. Is it okay now?
4 THE ACCUSED ZUPLJANIN: [Interpretation] Yes, it is. I can hear
5 it well.
6 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you.
7 We then proceed to the appearances. May I have the appearances
8 first for the Office of the Prosecutor, please.
9 MS. KORNER: Good afternoon, Your Honour. Joanna Korner,
10 Matthew Olmsted, and Gramsci Di Fazio, assisted by case manager
11 Crispian Smith for the Prosecution.
12 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you. And Defence counsel.
13 MR. CVIJETIC: [Interpretation] Good afternoon, Your Honour, good
14 afternoon to my learned friends from the Prosecution. My name is
15 Slobodan Cvijetic. I'm a co-counsel in the Defence team of the accused
16 Mico Stanisic.
17 MR. PANTELIC: Good afternoon, Your Honour. Igor Pantelic,
18 co-counsel for Mr. Zupljanin.
19 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you.
20 The reasons for this Status Conference is that it is been now
21 120 days since the last time there was a Status Conference on
22 20 November 2008, administered by Judge Prost. And the parties are well
23 aware, also the accused, of the purpose of the Status Conferences. As
24 for the Status Conference here today, I just want to, already at this
25 stage, mention that both parties have an interest in -- for different
Page 15
1 reasons, that, if possible we should deal with the Status Conference, of
2 course, deal with all necessary business, but, if possible, adjourn
3 within half an hour, approximately.
4 I would also like to mention what has -- or reiterate what has
5 already been communicated to the parties. That it is still the intention
6 of this Tribunal to have all necessary preparations pre-trial stage-wise
7 done so that the possibility is there to start the trial before the
8 summer recess. So there is nothing new -- there is nothing new with a
9 view to that intention already communicated to the parties.
10 For the pending motions, I am informed that from the 65 ter
11 conference that was held this morning, a detailed -- a detailed
12 mentioning of all pending motions were gone through with the parties. I
13 will briefly dwell on a few of these, but I see no need to repeat or go
14 over again in detail with the parties those pending motions.
15 I will mention that there -- there is now a filed decision on the
16 form of the indictment, that was yesterday, so 19 March, and in
17 conformity with what the Defence have requested earlier, they will now
18 have two weeks' limit in which to comment on the motion from the
19 Prosecution on amendments of the indictment. I should point out that it
20 is the first motion of 1st December 2008 that is the main focus here,
21 because the second motion, supplementary motion of 2nd March, 2009, the
22 Defence have already commented upon. So it's basically, as I see it, the
23 motion of 1st December 2008 and some of these issues also had an aspect
24 or a side to issues that were dealt with in the decision now filed on the
25 form of the indictment.
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1 So it would follow, then, that by 2nd April there should be
2 submissions from Defence on the Prosecution motion to amend the
3 indictment.
4 As for Rule 92 bis, 92 ter, and 92 quater. 94 bis further
5 judicial notice of adjudicated facts, further Rule 65 ter witness and
6 exhibit lists, and access to materials in other cases, I rely on the
7 65 ter conference. And if the parties have matters within what I have
8 already now mentioned they want to raise also here, please do so. But if
9 not, I will just proceed.
10 MS. KORNER: Your Honour, just this. Your Honour I assume is
11 referring to the responses on behalf of Zupljanin, that they were not
12 proposing to reply until there had been a ruling on the form of the
13 indictment. So that we understand it, they have been given 14 days now
14 to respond.
15 JUDGE STOLE: Exactly.
16 MS. KORNER: Thank you very much, Your Honour, just for
17 clarification.
18 JUDGE STOLE: The same approach, I would suggest to follow as for
19 disclosure, I have also here been given a briefing by the Senior Legal
20 Officer after the 65 ter conference, so I'm well aware of the points
21 raised there, and I rely on the parties to have contact, to -- directly
22 between themselves, to deal with the questions that were mentioned in the
23 65 ter conference.
24 The parties will remember that on the last Status Conference on
25 20 November 2008, Judge Prost raised the issue of agreed facts, whether
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1 it would be -- that it would be desirable that the parties continue their
2 efforts with a view to presenting further agreed facts. I will only
3 reiterate this now, at this stage. As far as I'm -- as far as I'm
4 briefed now, there is no new development as yet, in the form of further
5 agreed facts, but the Trial Chamber will still ask the parties to see if
6 this is a possibility to further advance on agreed facts.
7 Are there any other issues that the parties would like to raise?
8 Naturally, I will give the floor to the accused towards the end of the
9 Status Conference, with a view to detention and matters like that. But
10 would there be any other matters before we go to that stage of the Status
11 Conference?
12 MS. KORNER: No, thank you, Your Honour.
13 MR. CVIJETIC: [Interpretation] Your Honour, I quite agree with
14 what has been said so for. We had a constructive meeting at the 65 ter
15 conference. We agreed to deal with all of the problems you have been
16 informed of through various discussions, save for the saying that the
17 door should never remain shut if we are to keep channels open. There's
18 nothing much for me to add. We shall continue discussing further
19 disclosure of evidence and related issues.
20 I have nothing to inform you in addition to what was discussed
21 this morning.
22 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you.
23 MR. PANTELIC: Yes, Your Honour, just a minor intervention to the
24 transcript, page 2, line 17, instead of co-counsel for Mico Stanisic it
25 should be co-counsel for Zupljanin. Not a big deal.
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1 At this stage I have nothing to add, maybe depending off our
2 time-frame today, I will raise one minor issue, but it is not so of big
3 importance.
4 Thank you.
5 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you for that.
6 The condition of the accused, first, with a view to Stanisic that
7 is currently on provisional release, is there information from counsel
8 concerning his health? I would like to give the floor to counsel for
9 Stanisic.
10 MR. CVIJETIC: [Interpretation] Thank you, Your Honour.
11 Mr. Stanisic, is in good mental and physical health, and he
12 enjoys being free. Thank you.
13 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you.
14 That brings me, Mr. Zupljanin, to you. And first I would like to
15 hear also from you on, who are in detention, if there are matters
16 directly related to the detention that you would like to raise.
17 THE ACCUSED ZUPLJANIN: [Interpretation] Concerning detention,
18 Judge Stole, I wouldn't say anything special. You know well what life in
19 detention unit is like. I'm more concerned with the issue of my Defence,
20 and this is why I believe it is necessary for me to say a couple of
21 sentences concerning my Defence. And, of course, within the limitations
22 of time today, because of this mass or service that I'm going to attend.
23 Of course, my Defence will reflect heavily upon this case. My
24 Defence team is still cutting their milk teeth, and it will take them
25 time to be -- fall on their feet, and I have been in detention for
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1 ten months. As early as on the 13th February, I demanded that my counsel
2 be removed. The secretariat did not or Registry did not agree. Then I
3 filed a motion to reconsider, and I'm still awaiting for a reply. Both
4 you and I are facing problems.
5 JUDGE STOLE: Mr. Zupljanin, I would like to state at this stage,
6 I will not prevent you from briefly mentioning the issue of your legal
7 representation. However, I am aware that there has been a decision by
8 the Registrar and that review by the President is being asked or has been
9 requested so that the position as of today is that this issue is before
10 the President of this Tribunal. It is not before the Trial Chamber, at
11 least not at the moment. It may or may not be before the Trial Chamber
12 later, but not today certainly.
13 So with that in mind, I would -- I would ask you to make these
14 submissions relatively short.
15 THE ACCUSED ZUPLJANIN: [Interpretation] I'll try to be as brief
16 as possible. I said this to inform the Bench at today's
17 Status Conference, but I will continue.
18 I see we, both you and I, are in grave problems in my opinion.
19 The beginning of the trial is not even on the horizon, although you said
20 that will come before -- before the summer break. We need 24-hour/7 work
21 to start preparing our Defence, and I have been charged with offences
22 which certain my whole life being spent in prison, and I am innocent.
23 Mr. Stanisic has been preparing his Defence for the fifth year
24 running since he was in detention, and three fourths of that time he
25 spent outside detention. So let's cut a long story short, I would like
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1 to propose to this Bench the only thing that is viable in this situation,
2 and that is for the purpose of intensive preparations for my Defence that
3 I be put on provisional release so that I'll be in the same status as
4 Mr. Stanisic and I could focus on preparing my defence. Otherwise, I
5 deeply believe that there will be no mention of a trial during this year,
6 if I am to face a fair trial. If the intendency [as interpreted] of my
7 Defence work continues at the same pace, I don't believe that the next
8 year either we'll see the beginning of my trial.
9 Thank you.
10 JUDGE STOLE: Thank you, Mr. Zupljanin.
11 It is it, of course, open to any accused and detained accused in
12 this Tribunal to request for provisional release. That is it open to you
13 at any given time. As now -- as of now, there is no such request or has
14 not been such a request before us. You may want to, I take it, discuss
15 this with your Defence, and then, if that is your wish, make such
16 requests in the proper channels, in the proper way before the
17 Trial Chamber.
18 THE ACCUSED ZUPLJANIN: [Interpretation] Thank you.
19 JUDGE STOLE: If there would be, then, no other business during
20 this Status Conference, we'll adjourn.
21 --- Whereupon the Status Conference adjourned
22 at 2.38 p.m.
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